i'm not far from publishing a book on motorcycle road racing circtuis in new zealand, 88 circuits in the north island and still to do a final tally but looking at around 63 in the south island 151 ish all up
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many of the circuits ran cars as well of course.
A lot of stuff is scattered through this thread on Seagrove and recently quite a few photos from the Arthur Siddall albums now in Duncan Fox hands [ found at Whitford Tip by Duncan ].
Could be worth putting into a separate story - a bit like the Matamata thread that " Oldfart "started a few years ago.
I have also recently acquired a couple of Maps of the Seagrove Track - one from the 1940's and the other a more recent Google image.
There was a book written about Seagrove some years ago - must check out the details.
" jellywrestler " is writing a book on New Zealand Motorcycle Racing and has quite a bit of information on the track from a Two Wheeled perspective.
Seagrove.... Where's that? by Max Poole I got a copy from Max, was about $90 he gets them done in very small runs, from memory he only really got what was pre ordered rather than kept a couple in stock. covers a bit on the car racing, more on the bikes. My book covers 156 differnt circuits in new zealand. this includes closed circuits, airfield circuits, street circuits and road racing circuits, (coutryside venues) it's getting close to being published, and i'll pop in here and advertise it no doubt. I will be selling it myself, at this stage apart from selected motorcycle shops that's my plan. A number of the circuits of course included cars, or probably more correct, the cars ran a meeting and invited the bikes.
If one lands at Los Angeles Airport and heads north toward Santa Barbara on Interstate Highway 405, a few miles up the road you can go west on Interstate Highway 10 toward the Pacific Ocean and Santa Monica. (Remember I have mentioned previously hat the north to south highways have odd numbers and the east to west highways are even numbered. Just remember that when you come to visit !)
In 1909 Santa Monica had established a road course for the "ill handling, temperamental machines "of that era. They were heavy, high torque beasts which required long stretches of straight road to get up to full speeds. Therefore some of the Vanderbilt Cup circuits were long, such as the Savannah, Georgia circuit which was over 17 miles around ! This meant that spectators wandered around without restrictions and race drivers had to also contend with the occasional dog or horse on the course.
The Santa Monica course was 8.4 miles and had races there from 1909 to 1919.
Attachment 69882
The same roads can be driven on today.
(Ken H )
You could always see if it's on here:
https://oscarplada.blogspot.com/
Oscar does brilliant maps.
Thanks Ray,
That first map was pretty cruddy.
After the start going in an anti-clockwise direction the first corner was a left hander onto the almost 4 mile straight along Wilshire Blvd.
That corner was named Dead Man's Curve or Death Corner and although it was the scene of some hair raising accidents there were no fatalities at this spot over the 10 years of racing at Santa Monica.
The accidents were often caused by the failure of the wooden wheels and tire blow outs as tires were still in the early stages of handling the strains of racing.
A popular tire at the time was the Diamond brand.
This is a scene which is remarkable that it was captured by the early cameras at exactly the same moment from the front and the rear.
1914 as the race leader John Marquis in his Sunbeam, rolled after a tire blew rounding Dead Man's Curve amazingly the occupants were not killed and Marquis was pulled from the wreckage and lived to drive another day.
Attachment 69883
Another popular driver, Eddie Pullen crashed at the same corner during the 1914 Vanderbilt Cup Race. He also was leading in his Mercer when a tire blew. Neither he nor his mechanician were seriously injured and were back racing the same car two days later !
These guys were tough and very brave !
Attachment 69884
( Eddie Pullen has an appointment with the barriers, as a wheel breaks loose. Note spectators (left) running for their lives, the brave camera-man, and onlookers up a telegraph pole. )
Ken H..
The same corner today at Wilshire Blvd and Ocean Avenue in Santa Monica is not quite as exciting as it was in 1914.
Attachment 69890
(Google maps.)
(Ken H)
In 1909 before it became a popular track and European cars arrived, Santa Monica hosted some early US manufacturers as seen in this listing of the race results.
Attachment 69892
The winning race car was a "Apperson Jackrabbit"
Attachment 69893
Second place was a Chadwick racer # 16 driven by Bruno Seibel.
Attachment 69896
Also in the field was popular local driver Ted Tetzlaff driving a Lozier
Attachment 69895
Attachment 69897
( ( Ken H )
It must have been fun racing that 1912 model in 1909!
Roger,
Ray Bell was correct as at the time he posted I had carelessly put in a fine rendition of a 1912 Chadwick in action.
I changed my post as I knew I would be corrected from afar !
Ken H
" changed my post " Yep done that a few times too !! As you know ..
Cheers Ken H,
Roger
I am amazed at how many automobile manufacturers were in the USA at the early part of the 20th century and were mostly gone within 25 years.
.
The Lozier automobile was a prime example.
" Loziers were top line luxury cars and for a time were the most expensive cars produced in the United States. The 1910 model line featured cars priced between US$4,600 and US$7,750. The same year, a Cadillac could be had for about US$1,600 and a Packard US$3,200. A pre-assembly line Ford Model T of the same year retailed at approximately US$850 (after installing assembly line production a few years later, new Model Ts sold for as little as US$240). The average annual salary in America that year was approximately US$750.
Lozier tried to expand into the mid priced car market and in 1914 offered a four-cylinder car priced at US$2,000. It faced competition from the US$2000 Enger 40,[6] the cheaper FAL at US$1750,[6] the US$1600 Oakland 40,[7] The Chalmers Super Six at US$3200, Cole Four at US$1925,[8] and Western's US$500 Gale Model A roadster,[9] to name just a few. The new four was not a sales success and company finances continued to falter. After a failed attempt to merge with Ford Motor Company, the company declared bankruptcy in 1915. (Wikipedia)
Due to WW1 and the Depression years things did not go as planned for many.
This site covers those defunct automobile manufacturers of the United States.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...nited_States#L
(Ken H..)
Many car makers benefited from the war years...
Their manufacturing facilities were going full-time making munitions, aircraft parts and the like. Packard built lots of Rolls-Royce Merlin engines, something which is very well known of course. I was reading recently that the difference in plan-reading between the US and the UK meant they had to re-draw the plans before building the engines. And that they were more consistent in their manufacturing standards.
Willys, of course, built the Jeeps. Ford built plenty of them too. Willys was the original designer and builder, they didn't see out the fifties. Nor did Studebaker, who supplied trucks for armies in large numbers.
Back in WW1 people like Hispano-Suiza were famous for their aircraft engines, as were Rolls-Royce. It's hard to see a car maker who got defence-oriented contracts in those years going under. Unless, of course, they changed course after the war because of what they'd learned, or the under-quoted.
An interesting subject to ponder...
Ray Bell,
: " Packard built lots of Rolls-Royce Merlin engines, something which is very well known of course. I was reading recently that the difference in plan-reading between the US and the UK meant they had to re-draw the plans before building the engines. And that they were more consistent in their manufacturing standards. "
You must have been reading what I have just read or something similar
- the latest issue of " New Zealand Classic Driver " has an article by Allan Dick about the" Packard Museum "
- actually a collection of Packards, a lot of English Cars and Farming Machines.
I thought the collection had gone as the owner whom I knew back in the 1980's had passed away.
Turns out that indeed Graham Craw passed away in 2007,however his son Fenton Craw who I also knew is the current Owner /Custodian..
I digress, sorry - old timers issue ....
The story is, as you say, Packard built a better - as in more reliable - version of the Rolls Royce Merlin.
To you and Ken H - keep this stuff coming.
"The story is, as you say, Packard built a better - as in more reliable - version of the Rolls Royce Merlin."
Possibly, but notably without bombs falling around them and not needing housewives and daughters on the assembly line. The fact is that they could not come up with a near equivalent design. Refer Mustang.
Well said Trevor,
Recently read a couple of book about - " Home " - England / Britain, during WW2 and yes, a very tough life with severe rationing while the Americans had a war that apart from Pearl Harbour, their lifestyle just kept going.
Good to read a comment from you.
Cheers
Roger
In the 1909 Santa Monica Light Car Race there was a Buick # 9, entered by the Howard Auto Company.
This was one of the first races for Charles Howard. Early on Charles Howard bet on the future of the automobile, buying a ticket to Detroit. There he finagled a meeting with Will Durant, the owner of Buick Automobiles and future founder of General Motors.Attachment 69914
Durant sent him back home to establish dealerships and soon Howard, at age 28, was in charge of the Buick franchise for San Francisco. Howard sold 85 cars in just one year, at the astronomical price of $1,000 each. In 1909, Durant showed his gratitude by giving him control over all distributorships in the western United States. Almost 20 years later he bought a cheap racehorse as he saw it had potential.
You can see that story in the movie "Seabiscuit."
Attachment 69911
Attachment 69912
Attachment 69913
p.s. Why were most US built cars RHD at this time in 1909 ?
(Ken H)
I found this article regarding steering wheels on the right and then the left.
Attachment 69923
(Ken H )
I found this collection of the early Santa Monica races at a library which I contacted and they were happy to have them put on TRS but they would be grateful if I could identify the photos a little better than "Two Cars in Motion" or "Two cars and Crowd " etc..
So I will give it a go. They are not in order by year.
First the two cars in motion is a photo taken at the February 1914 event.
William Carlson and his mechanic are anxiously looking back from their Mason # 10 as they round the Deadman's Corner ahead of the fast approaching Mercedes # 12 of eventual race winner, Ralph De Palma.
Attachment 69943
I also found this clipping of how important these races were to the growth and establishment of Santa Monica back in the early 1900s.
" The Santa Monica Road Races were held 1909-1919. They were instrumental in keeping Santa Monica from being annexed into Los Angeles.
Put on by the city, auto dealers, and real estate developers, they were used as a promotion to bring people to Santa Monica from across the country. The course (which can be run today) ran from Ocean & Montana to Wilshire Boulevard, uphill to San Vicente and back to Ocean. Barney Oldfield, Ralph DePalma, Eddie Pullen, and Terrible Teddy Tetzlaff competed in what were the biggest race meets in the country at that time."
(Ken H..to be continued )
" Ken H..to be continued " We hope so,
what a good find..
my latest picture is much newer, but still old, have a look at the Northern Sports Car Club thread.
Cheers Ken H.
Roger
Thanks Roger,
Motoring and racing history is fun and I enjoy plunking away at it even it is regarding a location / event far from Aotearoa.
The early Santa Monica races were photographed by Bartlett, Adelbert, 1887-1966 (photographer)
The copyright holder of these items has granted permission to make them publicly available on the web.
This next photo was titled; "Is this the Start or the Finish ?"
This a scene from the grandstand by the Start / Finish line on October 14, 1911.
It shows the first event with Bert Dingley being flagged away at 8.30 am in his Pope-Hartford # 2.
The cars were set off in 30 second intervals for as you can see due to the smoke and dust etc. !
The next car is the # 5 National driven by Charles Merz.
Attachment 69945
Note the large crowd in the stands and also notice how well the women that were present, were dressed.
The Los Angeles Times reported on the 1911 event;
" The crowds stretched around the entire eight mile course and down the sides of Ocean Front Boulevard as far as the eye could see."
(Ken H..)
February 26 1914. Vanderbilt Cup Race. Santa Monica.
Starting in front of the large crowd.
Gil Anderson in his Stutz # 3 ( This was the first Stutz ever built )
in front of Fiat # 9 driven by Frank Verbeck.
Attachment 69952
( Ken H ..)
1914 February 26th.
As seen in my earlier post. the LHD Mason # 10 of William Carlson was still leading the RHD Mercedes #12 of Ralph DePalma further around the course.
Attachment 69953
But at the end the Mercedes had come through to win easily as shown in this scene from a Mercedes brochure.
" Win on Sunday, Sell on Monday "
Attachment 69954
For the first time on TRS. A short clip of Charlie Chaplin at the 1914 Santa Monica races.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tn83OIxaF5s&t=4s
Some slapping shown that would not be tolerated in any filming today !
(Ken H..)
More photo identification.
"Two Cars and Crowd."
Is actually Harry Grant in his Isotta # 1 waiting to start alongside the # 2 Mercer of Spencer Wishart before the 1914 event.
Attachment 70003
The number 12 Mercedes was a two year old car in 1914 but with the skillful driving of Ralph DePalma made it a winner here at Santa Monica and a year later the same car and driver won the 1915 Indianapolis 500.
Attachment 70004
Attachment 70005
It was surprising to find that a Mercedes powered Mercedes would not win a Grand Prix event in the US for 100 years when Lewis Hamilton won the 2014 US Grand Prix at Austin, Texas.
( Ken H)
Another fast Mercedes at that time was known as the "Blitzen Benz" driven in 1911 by Bob Burman who sadly lost his life at the at the 1916 Corona race as told in the Post # 395.
A good description of the car and it's history can be found in this article.
http://www.autospeed.com/cms/article...zenBenz&A=2745
Attachment 70010
(Ken H...)
I purchased the Klemantski book on Blitzen Benzes, interesting how much muddied "history" there is. I didn't realize there was more than one. Muddied like NZ history is becoming :)
While Benz and Mercedes were close at that time, they weren't to merge until 1926.
When one sees how little crowd control there was at early Vanderbilt races, it is surprising there were not more incidents like the one that happened at Santa Monica in November 1916 that hastened the end of road racing at this site.
Vanderbilt road racing and lack of crowd control, 1904
https://www.loc.gov/item/00564552
This peaceful present day photo of the place in Santa Monica where in 1916 a Marmon racer driven by Lewis Jackson, had steering failure on this slight curve and jumped the curb across about where that white vehicle is parked.
Although there were 4 fatalities and others injured and it happened on the 13th lap, the race carried on and finished as scheduled on the 48th lap !
Attachment 70019
A graphic of when things go horribly wrong.
Attachment 70020
(Ken H)
Plenty of Old Race Tracks in this new NZ book on Road Racing Circuits, 160 of them actually. http://www.theroaringseason.com/show...-on-the-market