The Roaring Season Questionnaire: Please Read And Reply

[Steve Holmes]

I started The Roaring Season 20 months ago in early 2011, as a place I could write articles for enjoyment, and keep in touch with fellow car enthusiast friends. It started as a hobby, and one in which I controlled and could work around my other commitments. In the 20 months since it began, the site has grown at pace, and become much larger than I imagined it would in such a short space of time. Like a living creature, its taken on a life and character, and personality of its own, and its fascinating for me to see it evolve. I love opening the site each morning to see what has been posted the night before.

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The knowledge that is on the site, through the members who all contribute something special, just amazes me. Everyone here, whether through filling in the gaps, sharing their knowledge, or even asking questions, help, or advise, all play a role in making this site what it is, a large and enjoyable motorsport community. I’ve been privileged to have been offered some fascinating photo collections, mostly amateur, some professional, and each telling its own amazing story.

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This is a website, and, more importantly, a community I’m proud to be a part of. However, its also a website which is taking up more and more of my time, its taking a toll on my ability to earn money through working on my business, and its taking a toll on my energy. Since I began The Roaring Season 20 months ago, I’ve spent thousands of hours working on it, and thousands of dollars. Each morning I spend at least a couple of hours here, working through recent posts to make sure everyone is behaving, working on articles, and working on photo collections, both resizing images, and researching where I can the stories each image tells. I have to analyze every new member who joins, to decipher if they’re genuine, or a hoax just trying to use the site to sell unrelated advertising. I pay a web developer each month to check through all the files to make sure there have been no attempts to hack the site, and clean up corrupt files that shouldn’t be here. In the very near future I’m going to have to invest in making the site mobile, so when travelling, I can keep a constant watch on it.

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Basically, I’m spending so much time working in the site, I’m not working on the site. I want for it to be fascinating, for there to be acres of reading material for people to enjoy, and increasing photo collections. But the number of articles I’m able to write is slipping, because I can’t commit the time to them anymore.

Essentially, for me to spend more time on The Roaring Season, to grow the site and offer more of interest to my fellow enthusiasts, it needs to be earning money. And its not. And as a result, I’m becoming increasingly frustrated that its nowhere near as good as I want it to be, because I need to go off and earn a living. I have bills to pay. Eventually, as the site grows, advertisers may come on board, but right now, I’m spending large amounts of time each month on something that doesn’t even pay its own running costs, let alone my time.

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Recently, it was suggested to me by a few people on here the idea of members and visitors (there are approx. 10 times the number of non-members who visit the site each month to actual registered members) paying a donation. Although I appreciate the gesture, that thought just didn’t sit right with me, as this site is not a charity.

However, other than being an online community, The Roaring Season is essentially an online magazine. It features articles, photo collections, event previews and reviews, in addition to having a very lively and interesting discussion forum. And so, as is the case with any magazine, my thoughts of late to grow The Roaring Season as I’d like to see it grow, would be to charge a small annual subscription, just as any magazine would.

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As I’ve let this idea grow in my mind, so it feels like the right direction for the site. My thoughts are that each person wishing to gain full access to the site, the articles, photo collections, discussion forum etc, would pay an annual subscription of NZ$45 (which works out at NZ0.86 cents per week). As the average time spent on the site each time they visit (and for some its several times a day) is 7 min: 12sec this seems like a pretty good bang for buck. However, I’m wary that people may resent being asked to pay for what they currently get for free. But, with money coming in from subscriptions, the amount of time I could spend on the site, on photo collections, and on articles, could greatly increase. Furthermore, I could also pay other journalists around the world to submit articles, be they historical, event reviews, or other, so subscribers could enjoy a far more diverse an interesting website. The content would greatly increase, as would the quality of what will be on offer, to make this altogether a more fascinating place, but without losing its all-important community feel.

However, I’d also like your feedback on this. To take the site to the next level, you’re going to be the people who help make this happen. So I’d like to know what you think of paying an annual subscription. Is NZ$45 too much to pay, or too little? Is the thought of asking you to pay anything at all an insult? If you had the choice of the site being shut down tomorrow, or pay NZ$45, which would you prefer?

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I’d really like to get as much feedback, good or bad, about this as possible. To make any step in this direction would be high risk without first hearing from those affected by it. Please let me know your thoughts, either by replying in this thread, or emailing me personally: theroaringseason@gmail.com I want to know what you think, good or bad.

Thanks for your time everyone.

Cheers
Steve Holmes

[Shoreboy57]

Steve

You are not alone, your challenge is that faced by most online media. Most I wouldn't bother with if they put up a paywall but the ever improving quality of this site is such that I would happily pay the suggested $45 / year for full access. The only caveat would be that if it meant losing so many of the fine contributors you have then much of the value goes, but hopefully that wouldn't be the case.

Lindsay

[Dave Silcock]

Steve,
I have been talked into joining this site, and some times feel that I am a dinasor in regards to what the current scene is all about, but I would be more than happy to pay your suggested fee to keep it going.
Cheers Dave.

[Tunny7]

Hi Steve, I'd happily pay around the $50.00 mark to have access to the site. I agree with Lyndsay's comment above re contributors staying on board would be vital.

Cheers, Richard.

[AMCO72]

Steve......$45 is only a couple of packets of fags for goodness sake!!!!

As I have now sold the Amco Mini, I will be resigning from a couple of car clubs I currently belong to, and will quite happily invest that money in the roaring season, as I get MUCH more value out of it than any club can offer.........

[car mad]

Steve .........$45 is not a lot to pay for the enjoyment my family gets from this web site and we are only too happy to help invest in The roaring season .......My two children( 12 & 14 ) are learning about the golden years of motorsport
cheers Adrian

[Spgeti]

Steve, to me this give more value than my current car club, to which the yearly fee is $90.00. I would gladly pay a membership fee for access to this fantastic site and for you to be able to earn a living from it.
Cheers, Bruce

[Allan]

Hello Steve. I have no problem with paying a fee to have access to the wonderful comments, anecdotes and photos that appear on this site. I have recommended this site to a few of my friends because there is more interesting information here than in any of the books published about NZ motorsport over the years, and I mean no disrespect to those like Graham Vercoe (whose Historic Racing Cars of New Zealand is one of my favourite books) in saying this.
I belong to other forum type sites that ask for a donation before allowing posts or access to certain parts of the site and I also have no problem with that. Your site is a credit to you and the interesting characters who abound here and like myself have had an interest and occasional dabble at the sport. My interest goes back to the very early sixties. Keep up the good work and come on fellas, let's keep this thing going and growing.
Regards,
Allan

[MarkQ]

Hi Steve, I think $45 is money well spent, I would easily spend more on car magazines that I buy as they have one article I'm interested in. I get alot more enjoyment from reading the info posted here than any other motorsport related forum. After all most of the pictures and stories posted our about our wee country's motorsport history, its a log of fact's and details that are of huge benefit for not only todays members but for years to come.
Regards,
Mark

[fullnoise68]

Steve, now you`re talking. To all you people out there, $45 is peanuts for what`s on offer. Steves commitment to this website is equalled by his efforts for our Historic Muscle Car class, and his time and effort, not to mention the enjoyment it brings, can`t really be measured in dollar terms. I suggest that Steve posts a bank account number for us to pay into by say the 20th March, so his efforts are rewarded, rather than overlooked.

Steve Elliott.

[SPman]

Steve - $45 is fine. I donate about $100 a year to various websites, because they are a hub of knowledge and photos. It's also enjoyable to be able to browse material that others know what you're talking about - espec out here in the wilds of WA.
Paypal is good.
John Liddle

[David McKinney]

I'd be happy to pay (and I'm not even in NZ:) )

[Grant Ellwood]

Excellent value to keep this site alive. Like Steve and probably everyone else, it is the first "news" I check early each morning.

[beowulf]

Steve, wonderful site, I check it every morning and evening. Such a wealth of information available to all of us. Quite happy to pay
to belong.
Beowulf

[Bruce Sollitt]

$45.00 ? No problem. Most interesting motorsport site by far without the bitchiness of most others.

[Steve Holmes]

Wow, this is absolutely awesome guys! Really great feedback, and really good information to know. Please keep the feedback coming, I really want to hear from as many people as possible, including members and visitors. Please feel free to email me if you don't want to post your comments here.

Just so you all know, if this goes ahead, there will be plenty of warning, and you'll get a taste for what the future holds with an increase in the number of articles being posted as it ramps up. I don't want anyone to think you'd just suddenly be paying for what you currently get for free. The site will be a lot more interesting.

The key is getting the annual subscription rate as low as possible so that its easily affordable for everyone, but also generating enough funds to help propel the site on to better things, to make it a more enjoyable experience for everyone here.

Thanks again everyone, keep the feedback coming.

[kiwi285]

Hi Steve,

I would be more than happy to pay $45 pa to be able to access this site and the amazing information that it continues to turn up. Let us know when and how to pay up.

Just look at the photos at the start of this thread.

Cheers Mike

[kiwi285]

Steve......$45 is only a couple of packets of fags for goodness sake!!!!

As I have now sold the Amco Mini, I will be resigning from a couple of car clubs I currently belong to, and will quite happily invest that money in the roaring season, as I get MUCH more value out of it than any club can offer.........

Hi Gerald, sent you a PM Cheers Mike

[jim short]

Count me in Steve, if only to see amco in new Mustang{only a rumor so far}

[Horizon]

What David Mck, said.

[GD66]

Ditto. What do you think about setting up the subscription/membership payment through Paypal, Steve? That way those of us overseas (and in NZ, for that matter) can pay up just through a relevant email address. Am unaware of the client requirements, though...

[Ellis]

Ditto a paypal setup

[Michael Clark]

Ditto again

[Carlo]

Count me in, we need to have the history of the sport in NZ recorded, including all the tales that circle around the tales

[seaqnmac27]

I'd be happy to pay.

[ERC]

Maybe I am the first to be a bit hesitant? As a newcomer to NZ (30 years ago!), much that is of interest to those who have been around longer is of little interest to me. Several threads therefore don't get read. I already subscribe to 5 or six magazines a month and currently I have difficulty in keeping up with reading them all. Now work and income has dried up a fair bit, then cost starts to come into it, especially with a winter cruising habit to feed.

My main reason for participating in this board is as a discussion board as like several others, I work on my own and it replaces the lunch room chat.

However, I too have invested a fair but of time scanning and posting photographs for the enjoyment and education of others (probably to the detriment of keeping my own websites up to date - it is addictive!).

Either this site is primarily a message board with occasional articles, or is an on line magazine with a larger contribution from readers, or it is the home page for HMC.

If it is primarily for articles, then it has to stack up against my other paid for reading material and has to be assessed as to what I am to get out of those articles. Currently, at least one paid for magazine has to go and although I am willing to pay for access to this site, I am not sure that attracting new members will be as easy in the future. If I was to pay for this site, then the first casualty would immediately be NZ Classic Car magazine.

One option Steve, is to share some of the workload by appointing moderators to "keep it clean" and maybe increase advertising revenue.

I am not too sure how many people currently contribute and how much of an income you'd therefore get. To be honest, I'd rather support it through a more substantial (annual) contribution from our race series, in return for a bit more of a mention in your articles away from this board of course!!!

[fullnoise68]

ERC, look at the bigger picture. The light at the end of the tunnel is not the train coming towards you, Steve wants to develop the website further and the general consensus is for that to happen and enjoy it even more!

[ElCoyote]

Colour me in

[Steve Holmes]

Ditto. What do you think about setting up the subscription/membership payment through Paypal, Steve? That way those of us overseas (and in NZ, for that matter) can pay up just through a relevant email address. Am unaware of the client requirements, though...

Yes this is exactly what would happen, I wouldn't be processing the payments myself, there would be a processing form as you find on other sites when purchasing a subscription or product etc.

[Steve Holmes]

Maybe I am the first to be a bit hesitant? As a newcomer to NZ (30 years ago!), much that is of interest to those who have been around longer is of little interest to me. Several threads therefore don't get read. I already subscribe to 5 or six magazines a month and currently I have difficulty in keeping up with reading them all. Now work and income has dried up a fair bit, then cost starts to come into it, especially with a winter cruising habit to feed.

My main reason for participating in this board is as a discussion board as like several others, I work on my own and it replaces the lunch room chat.

However, I too have invested a fair but of time scanning and posting photographs for the enjoyment and education of others (probably to the detriment of keeping my own websites up to date - it is addictive!).

Either this site is primarily a message board with occasional articles, or is an on line magazine with a larger contribution from readers, or it is the home page for HMC.

If it is primarily for articles, then it has to stack up against my other paid for reading material and has to be assessed as to what I am to get out of those articles. Currently, at least one paid for magazine has to go and although I am willing to pay for access to this site, I am not sure that attracting new members will be as easy in the future. If I was to pay for this site, then the first casualty would immediately be NZ Classic Car magazine.

One option Steve, is to share some of the workload by appointing moderators to "keep it clean" and maybe increase advertising revenue.

I am not too sure how many people currently contribute and how much of an income you'd therefore get. To be honest, I'd rather support it through a more substantial (annual) contribution from our race series, in return for a bit more of a mention in your articles away from this board of course!!!

Thanks Ray, its good to get feedback from bothsides. I want to hear both from those for and against the idea, as this is whatthe final decision would be based on.

[tonttu]

I'm in too. $50 ish is very reasonable.

[faminz]

Despite sounding possibly like a grinch I would note there's a price point where the $$ asked means many would not then login and therefore less contributors and therefore less value. Have you done a wee exercise on the cost of running it divided by say 80% of the current members? Is that where the $45 comes from? I'd be happier paying less as I think it would then keep the value up. You don't just want 30 - 40 members talking to themselves!
An alternative is to use Facebook as the site maybe which would do away with the maintenance costs and provide a mobile app as well!?
Just need some simplifying the linkage to the FB site..
Also more advertising ( in a discrete way ) and more linkage to your business might help. There's a ready audience here for the right nostalgic products so linkage to PayPal etc would also be an option before jumping into paid subscriptions I suggest.
My 2c worth.
That said I would pay say $20 no problem...

[mac]

Hi Steve, Count me in. I would hate to see the roaring season fade, its just to good. Be happy with 50 bucks . Colin Mac

[OCTARD-USA]

Steve, I'd be happy to pay, but I don't know that I would if I didn't already know what great content and community was within.

Because of that, I'd think you'd want to let the non-member see a bit of the site, to entice them into a membership. Without it, I fear that it will be difficult to attract the enthusiasts you want, that don't yet know what they're missing.

[David Manton]

Steve, I'd be happy to pay, but I don't know that I would if I didn't already know what great content and community was within.

Because of that, I'd think you'd want to let the non-member see a bit of the site, to entice them into a membership. Without it, I fear that it will be difficult to attract the enthusiasts you want, that don't yet know what they're missing.

I'm in...You're filling a previous gap in NZ historic motorsport. Doing a great job.

cheers
David M.

[Gerard Richards]

Yes I would be willing to pay an annual subscription of around $45 dollars. The Roaring Season has provided wonderful assess to a huge diverse range of NZ motorsport archival material that simply would not be available elsewhere, and it is worth it for that alone, in my view.

[BritishV8]

I would encourage you to consider other sources of revenue!

There should be a "Donate" button on every page, and there should be a "V.I.P." contributor list accessible from every page so that people can see that their friends have chipped in... alternatively or additionally, you could join the ranks of message boards which identify financial contributors in the lefthand column underneath their avatars. Some message boards have gold, silver, and bronze memberships to indicate varying contribution levels. Some message boards award benefits to membership, such as allowing people to upload more or larger photos.

If you only have five or six advertisers, you're clearly not be promoting your ad program aggressively enough. Maybe it's time to start making some cold calls?

There are other ways to find advertisers. I don't see any Google Adsense ads here. Surely there are affiliate ad programs you could join.

You may need to offer larger banners and/or more varied banner sizes.

If there's a subscription, you'll have to accept my regrets. I really admire this site, and I certainly do enjoy it when I visit, but I don't visit all that often. I've never been to New Zealand. I probably never will. I'm a man of modest means. I'm sorry that I can't help. It's a pity! I've enjoyed learning and sharing information about cars and drivers who have traveled back and forth between hemispheres and some of you have been complimentary about my posts. I guess I'll run into you on international message boards...

[ERC]

Good post British V8. I was beginning to think that there were only a couple on here to have made a more in depth assessment. Plenty for you to think about there Steve! I have found shrinking pics to post them to be a real problem and often, the quality is compromised

Also think #32 makes good points. Overseas viewers are probably content to browse as history shows that the majority of contributors are either kiwis or have a strong NZ connection.

I think that a charge may well limit it even more to Kiwis and slow the growth.

Not sure about Facebook though, as like many others, I have reservations about it. The current format is not dissimilar to other message boards, but as I said before, is it a message board or an on line magazine? People pay for magazines, but few pay for messsage boards.

Ten Tenths is free and quite a few posters on here also post on there - but generally without the pics!

[Russ Cunningham]

This is a difficult one to answer, Steve but since you asked for honest replies, here goes.

Firstly, you've done a great job with establishing TRS and full credit to you.

However, it's agreed that TRS must pay it's way. Fine! I understand but from my viewpoint I don't need to pay to socialise or to swap yarns about motor racing. I've many friends that I can do that with at any time. Most of these friends by the way will never look at or contribute to TRS even though I've urged them to do so.

Personally, I've enjoyed many of the contributions to TRS and have also enjoyed poking the borax at certain folk but I guess at heart I'm really just not that concerned whether it continues to exist or fades away. Do not take this as a personal insult Steve. You know I'm happy to assist motor racing folk and always will be but you did ask for honest input. Look at it this way: MotorMan was fantastic but it died. Motoring news, likewise but new growth comes through.

To put it in a nutshell that all who know me will understand: Sex is great but I ain't paying for it. Likewise TRS.

My opinion is tendered in full respect for what you have achieved with TRS.

All the very best,

Russ Cunningham

[worsel]

Hi Steve, happy to pay around the $50 mark, this is such a wonderful site. This is where I look 1st thing in the morning, before the newspaper, at lunchtime, as soon as I get home from work, and last thing before bed. Fantastic insight into NZ motorsport and more.

Cheers, Paul

[Craig Metcalf]

More than happy to pay $50ish. Bargain at the price.

[GeebeeNZ]

All this for less than a tank of gas. I would be happy to pay $45 and I guess Im not the only one on this site with a Gold Card.

Its a shame that the perception is that this sort of thing on the internet should be free. Steve we shouldn't expect you to do all this for nothing.

Graeme

[stubuchanan]

I am more than happy to pay the $45 or $50. Go back 2 or 3 years and and I was paying over $200 a year total for "SpeedSport"(died) and UK "Motor Sport"(got bored with it). I'm getting far more enjoyment and spending far more computer time (so wife complains) on Roaring Season, so it's not unreasonable to compensate those who are making it possible.

However, it needs plenty of thought. There has been interesting input from people who might have been discouraged if a fee was charged. Beware the "unintended consequences".

Stu Buchanan

[Buzzard]

Hi Steve,

Nothing good in life is free, and half a hundred or so for what you offer here is a no-brainer. People being people some will leave but every new member that signs up after the change will be doing so because they see the value in it. Might I suggest new users get a short free period to sample the content before getting out the credit card?

Onwards and upwards, my card is out and ready!

Buzz

[Kerryo]

Hi Steve,
I would not pay.
I did contribute a small article on the DeJoux cars but I would not have done so if I had to pay for it.
I think the site will wither if you make contributors pay.
Goodluck with what ever you decide.

Kerry O'Connor.

[GD66]

Its a shame that the perception is that this sort of thing on the internet should be free.


Jeez I'll say. 90c a week...how much do you waste on newspapers ?

[PonysiteEd]

Steve, I like this site very much and if it would be my only interest, I'd certainly pay for it.

Running a website for about 20 years now I know how much time goes into it as a private person and one is attempted to let it go more than once. I have seen many a site rise and disappear over the years. The biggest isssue is.. to maintain it and keep the level of visitors or grow it. When it grows you have a dilemma, if it fails, you can dig it. Now you are in the dilemma situation. More visitors, more pressure on you as the editor to fulfill expectations. I also think that with a payment the visitors number will eventually be less than half, yet if it is what you want and can maintain as fun for yourself and the others, just do it, Steve. It is your website now and you are free to do what you want (somewhat), if it is paid, you have a bigger obligation to fulfill expectations. Thats what kept me from accepting ads and any other offers, rather do what I want and when I want to speak out. But that is just personal. I will appreciate both ways you go, but probably not be able to pay for another source of information due to the others I pay.
Sometimes I still like to fuel up my own car. You might wish also to think of that. Sometimes I regret to have spent so much time in front of the PC instead of on the road. Value that for yourself. Good luck with your decision.

[john l]

No brainer,well worth the amount suggested

[Russ Cunningham]

Steve, maybe a focus on specializing in selling racecars, books, motor racing memorabilia, etc., might bring in the extra dollars. I would be more than happy to pay a percentage of the sale price and TRS may become the only place one goes to look for or sell such items. Worth a thought?

[Rod Grimwood]

Sorry been away, will be paying.

This is an amazing site, and whats 8 pints of beer for a year.

[PaulieG]

I would pay. I like the idea of a motorsport focussed auction section as Russ suggested. As a 29 yr old I missed out on all the good stuff and trying to find good books etc, without having to spend hours trawling through trademe, would be bliss. Love the website and I think 45 bucks for all the stories, photos, info and knowledge well worth it. Maybe having a couple of trusted admins may lighten the work load also Steve? If young uns like us dont gather the info it will all be lost!!!

[Lotus7Alfa]

...other than being an online community, The Roaring Season is essentially an online magazine. It features articles, photo collections, event previews and reviews, in addition to having a very lively and interesting discussion forum. And so, as is the case with any magazine, my thoughts of late to grow The Roaring Season as I’d like to see it grow, would be to charge a small annual subscription, just as any magazine would.

My thoughts are that each person wishing to gain full access to the site, the articles, photo collections, discussion forum etc, would pay an annual subscription of NZ$45 (which works out at NZ0.86 cents per week).

However, I’d also like your feedback on this. If you had the choice of the site being shut down tomorrow, or pay NZ$45, which would you prefer?

Thanks for your time everyone.

Cheers
Steve Holmes

Hi, I joined the forum to try and find out more about a car I had just bought and information on that has petered out. I log on every now and then to see if there are any interesting threads but very rarely find read any new ones that pique my interest. Some of the longer-running ones sound interesting but there is too much back history for me to wade through so I don't bother. I don't have time to read any of the articles, reviews, event previews etc. but have looked at a few of the photos.

I used to subscribe to several classic car magazines both from the UK and from NZ but have dropped all of them except "NZ Classic Car" either because they became poor value for money or because I didn't have time to raed one issue before the next one came out. I am a member of a couple of other (free) motoring internet sites and several others for other interests where I read some of the threads but only a very few.

Having read your proposal, if advertising revenue is not a realistic option for funding the site, I am in favour of you instituting a charge for access to the "archive" of articles, photo collections and a "Members Only" section of the forum but feel that there should still be free access to the general area of the forum. In answer to your final question, if I had to choose between paying NZ$45 or the site being shut down, I would be sorry to see it go but I wouldn't pay.

[Steve Holmes]

Hi everyone, thanks all for your replies. I've read every post, some more than once, and I appreciate everyone taking the time to read through my opening post and then taking the time to respond. The replies supporting the idea of an annual subscription and peoples reasoning for this are really interesting. Likewise, those against it are too. For me its a case of probably being too close to the forest to see the trees, which is why I appreciate your feedback. I've invested nearly 2 years in this site. I was driving along a few weeks ago and began calculating the time each week I spend working on the site, and was a bit stunned to realise I spend roughly 25 hours per week working on it! Whats even more scary is that I actually need to be spending more time than that on it to get it as I'd like it.

Please understand that the idea of an annual subscription is just that, an idea. I do need to monetize the site, I can’t keep investing the time I do in it without it earning money. Advertising is usually the most obvious option, but finding the time to try and lure advertisers is the sticking point, particularly in a tough economic climate. I’ve been in touch with a company who specialise in finding advertisers for websites, but they want me to increase the number of articles I’m writing, and increase unique visitor numbers a little more, and even then they can’t guarantee anything. So this is an option, but the timeframe and payback are something of an unknown.

I’m in the very early stages of working with an online promotions company to find a solution.

It may be that a dedicated paid subscribers forum area is created, separate from the existing General Discussion forum, and all the articles (both new and existing), photo collections, event reviews etc etc, go into that, and those paying the subscription have access to it, plus all the existing free view areas, while those choosing not to pay the subscription, only have access to the free areas. Those not paying could see a small part of the content (ie, the first couple of paragraphs of each article etc), so if they decided there was enough in there to warrant paying the subscription, they could, otherwise they could continue to enjoy the free areas.

Additionally, an online shop will also be created similar to what Russ has suggested above.

Anyway, still plenty to think about. Thanks again for the replies. They are really helpful.

[Bruce Blacklock]

$45 or $50 is a small price, even for us pensioners, for all the history that is being revealed on the site, . Like others who have expressed their concerns, I hope the quality contributions continue. How many subscribers do you need to make it viable?

[Bruce302]

Steve, I will happily pay the $ 45-50 as it represents good value as things stand now.

But, it doesn't seem to be a good long term business plan. Count the number of enthusiastic payers, it will be a nice little earner, for a while. The same regulars will be the main support, and over time the core support will shift, and you will be forever asking people to pay.

I have lost track of the number of forum sites that I have visited and used over the last 20 years. What was good for a while seems to loose traction as the next big thing comes along.

Advertising, and links to commercial sites with a "click fee" may be a better long term goal. I really want this to flourish, but I can't see it happening on the shoulders of only the previous 54 respondents (minus 4 or 5)

Bruce.

[Chris Read]

in. :) Chris Read - Arrowtown.

[John B]

Hi Steve,
More than happy with the idea of an annual subscription. In fact I paid my $50.00 into your bank account about three weeks ago. Hope you received it.
John

[Roger Dowding]

Steve, was holding back on my reply, as an overseas member, enjoy the kiwi motoring stuff, sounds a reasonable price, just boughtan American " Vintage Motorsport " magazine [ been geting them for about 15 years on and off ] which cost Aussie $ 17.95, they used to cost me about NZ $22 back in 2008 and converts to the same so two magazines and you are in. will folow with interest. cheers Roger

[Grant Sprague]

Yep Steve count me in no problem

[Gus]

Steve, I have only recently joined, count me in you have created an outstanding website and look forward to being able to contribute.

[ERC]

With only 60 posts in total, several being multiples and one or two not so keen, I am not sure that there are sufficient responses to really make a subscription viable Steve. Even if 50 were positive, it's not going to recompense you for the time invested.

[markson]

Hi Steve I have had a lot of enjoyment out of the site, and would be happy to contribute. Regards Markson

[Howard Wood]

It seems to me Steve that once the site is viewed as a commercial enterprise (whether you actually make any money or simply recover some of your costs is irrelevant) the whole ethos will change. For example. any contributor, especially photography copyright holders might not unreasonably expect some payment as currently happens in the print media.

One of the delightful aspects of TRS is the very ad hoc nature of it, ranging from some amazing and often previously undiscovered photos through the sober discussion and correction of historical detail to the whimsical reminiscing of "old time racing drivers" (come back Amco you need to update Yards and Yarns). Some forum readers are interested in all aspects, some in only their own particular narrow interest, either way it is a little community. I think there is a real danger that this will be lost should some kind of subscription be imposed.

Advertisers or a commercial arm linked to the site would allow you some opportunity of cost recovery, albeit at the cost of more of your time but not at the risk of polluting or altering the very thing you have worked so hard to create.

Of course, having argued against a formal subscription, I do suggest that you have a "donation box" attached to the site. I have no idea what the uptake would be but you just might find that the Anti Payment posters might just be the first contributors!

[AMCO72]

Howard, bless you for including me in that special breed.....'old time racing drivers'....now thats a big LOL!!!!!!! I would have thought that my antics at the Denny Hulme festival would have made it abundantly clear that I am not a racing drivers backside, old time or not.

Now Yards and Yarns........I was going to crank it back into action but I cant find it on the General Discussion post anymore. How does one find a thread that has not run for a while, or maybe I just start a new one.......advice please.

And while I'm at it, could I just say what a thoughtfully penned piece you wrote on the contributions or otherwise to the TRS.

[Steve Holmes]

Hi Gerald, the program we use for this website has a 'search' function, which you can find on the right side of the page, towards the top, on the same block as the navigation tabs with the words 'Advanced Search' beneath it. You'll see a white box in which you can enter the key words you wish to search. Its not perfect, but will eventually find you what you're looking for. But here is the Yards And Yarns thread: http://www.theroaringseason.com/showthread.php?158-Yards-And-Yarns&highlight=yards+yarns

[Steve Holmes]

Hello everyone, thanks all for taking the time to read through my opening post, and either replying your thoughts here or emailing me personally. Your responses have helped me make some decisions as to the future of the site. There is still much thinking and researching to be done, but this has at least answered some questions for me. But I just wanted to let you all know I've read through each and every post.

Thanks again to you all for your replies.

[jamie]

Hi Steve Count me in JAMIE A

[Howard Wood]

I should of course have also included amongst the roles TRS plays as being the "mast head" for race series such as HMC. I suspect that the extensive coverage here of HMC from its conception to Star of the Show at HD Denny Hulme has had a considerable influence on its success.

I know that unlike some other series there is no series entry fee (so far) for HMC but its not too much of a stretch to see that race promotors could benefit enormously from the sort of coverage, encouragement and promotion that has occurred via TRS. Even less of a stretch to see those promotors contributing to TRS from their entry fees as the promotion is mutually advantageous.

[ged]

hi steve as i now live o/s i find that TRS is far more topical than any magazine that i might subscribe to.they say looking back only gives you a sore neck, well i do not object to pay for that privilage. you do a truly wonderful job in running this site. looking forward to being more involved in the future

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks again you guys, I really appreciate it.

[Steve Holmes]

I should of course have also included amongst the roles TRS plays as being the "mast head" for race series such as HMC. I suspect that the extensive coverage here of HMC from its conception to Star of the Show at HD Denny Hulme has had a considerable influence on its success.

I know that unlike some other series there is no series entry fee (so far) for HMC but its not too much of a stretch to see that race promotors could benefit enormously from the sort of coverage, encouragement and promotion that has occurred via TRS. Even less of a stretch to see those promotors contributing to TRS from their entry fees as the promotion is mutually advantageous.

Howard, it amazes me that other historic racing groups aren't jumping on here and using this site to promote themselves. There are approx 6,000 visitors to the site each month, 160,000 page views, average time spent per visit is just over 7 minutes, and its growing every day. It costs nothing for clubs to be on here, telling everyone what they're up to, and ramping up enthusiasm, and yet HMC seems to be the only group that has made the effort to create its own thread and keep people up to speed with what they're doing. Most of the content on the HMC has been posted by Dale, and the thread has generated nearly 60,000 page views. And I'm sure its been of benefit to the group. Steve Elliott announced on the HMC thread in early January that he was taking his HMC Camaro out to Hampton Downs to run it for the very first time since purchasing it from the US. Despite the first test being on a Friday, quite a number of people who visit this site made the effort to get out to HD just to see the car!

I've actually tried emailing a few historic racing groups to encourage them to jump on here and promote their clubs, and have been largely ignored.

[Howard Wood]

Is there a potential income stream from "hosting" other race series web sites for them? I notice the BMW series web site does not seem to be working. Last year it was a living breathing thing with photos updates etc etc, maybe with a change in race committee, there is no longer anyone there with the skills to do this (believe me I couldn't) and if so I bet they are not the only ones with that dilemma.

3 things then happen: You at least get to share some costs, they have someone to run the site on an ongoing basis irrespective of the skills of the committee and a whole new group gets turned on to TRS.

[Mick]

How do I pay?

[Kwaussie]

I am happy to pay whatever it takes!
Maybe $50 pa so that the veiwer can open the photos - after the gos most people will veiw photos all night - paying a little will help the cause. The photos on here are very good and people all over the world will be downloading to add to their collections! make em pay a little!
nb if you don't pay the $50 the photos will not show [can your system handle this Steve?]

[225sloper]

Hi Steve im in as long as it stays just like this

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks again everyone for your replies and feedback. I really appreciate it. This direction for the site has required a lot of thinking and planning, and while there has been a good response here within this thread and through emails sent directly to me, there is still too much of a great unknown in venturing down this path, and for that reason turning The Roaring Season into a pay subscription site is not something worth taking a risk on. It may work, it may not, but I really don't have enough information to be able to confidently move the site in that direction, so will instead look to other means to keep it growing and trying to generate an income.

Thanks again all who replied.

[Wal Will]

I'm in.

[John B]

Thanks again everyone for your replies and feedback. I really appreciate it. This direction for the site has required a lot of thinking and planning, and while there has been a good response here within this thread and through emails sent directly to me, there is still too much of a great unknown in venturing down this path, and for that reason turning The Roaring Season into a pay subscription site is not something worth taking a risk on. It may work, it may not, but I really don't have enough information to be able to confidently move the site in that direction, so will instead look to other means to keep it growing and trying to generate an income.

Thanks again all who replied.

Hi Steve,
I understand your trepidation in making the site 'pay-to-view'. Although many of us would be happy to pay, the fear is you could lose more than you gain. Even if only a small percentage of current members chose not to subscribe, the site would be poorer for their loss. However, I have an idea about how we could potentially raise some funding for The Roaring Season. I'll contact you direct regarding the idea.
Cheers,
John (SPR Models)

[Allan]

This has got to be the best motorsport wesite around and as has already been said no nastys or bitches here. A classic example of this site is the Trekka thread which was posted I would imagine a little tongue in cheek and has developed with a slightly humerous but at the same time very interesting thread with little snippets of information and stories that would never have come to light otherwise. If we as members of this site need to contribute to keep it going then lets do that. I am happy to pay to keep this site up and running. We as a group of enthusiasts cannot afford to loose this asset because once it has gone it will never happen again.
Allan

[fullnoise68]

While I`m 100% for supporting TRS, I think the commercial `incentive/contribution' scheme, while logical, is not going to cut the mustard. I am not knocking those who want to support the website, but mathmatically it doesn`t add up. What Steve needs is a chunk of money to keep the website viable on the basis of being able to support himself while running and progressing it. If you are going to advertise or benefit commercially then some different options/rates need to be established and quite a few businesses - including mine -can get on board. All I can say to those who don`t like the idea of paying a donation of $50.00 annually is turn it around the other way - would you do all this for very little return??? Enjoy life, enjoy everyones contributions, but most of all realise that you are enjoying the benefits of Steves hard work and dedication. Small price to pay really................

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the support. The biggest issue in making this a pay subscription site is not the guys who've said they won't pay, but the people who've not said anything at all. Although there has been a good response both on here and through private emails to me from those happy to pay, there hasn't been nearly enough response for me to know if by taking that step I won't jeopardize the site. Even though in a way I have nothing to lose by trying it, given the site really doesn't generate any income, I've put nearly 2 years of work into it, and I don't really want to risk that.

So at this stage I'll need to build the finances through other means, such as advertising, and the offer made by John at SPR Models, which itself could prove quite beneficial if enough people get in behind it.

[bry3500]

no brainer Steve- I'm in

[Paul Kirk]

I certainly don't have a problem with an anual subscription!
Let me know the bank acc number.
PK.

[seaqnmac27]

I am in.

[paul lancaster]

Hi steve, I have been preaching the roaring season all over south canterbury, and only last week informed mark and leo leonard of it.im with all of the above mate,45 is no wories, I have search sites all over the world, and none have the history that trs has to offer.keep up the excellent work.

[Grant Sprague]

No probs Steve ......... you have made us all a bit younger re igniting the internal youth fire of a couple seasons gone by , not to mention the beautiful piks etc......... Steve please put yr deposit bank number up here as it has been lost ?????/ or would you please E mail me . thinking about it ... probably best here if it suits as we can all get it ?? THANK YOU STEVE

[Jizim]

Count me in Steve.

[Jizim]

Count me in Steve. Us Asians gotta stick together mate!

[Rod Grimwood]

Well, that explains some of the behavour changes Twony, aww you go fass ina saffee carr.

[Steve Holmes]

Wow you guys, how did you find this old thread? Thanks for the kind words, and the offers, but after much consideration, I decided against this option, as there were a few who were anti the idea, and I couldn't be sure of gaining enough subscriptions to make it work.

[Grant Sprague]

Steve , I am not going to judge any one here but surley if we here have an option to help & donate that would be our choice , some others might not feel they can & thats ok as well ????? Thanks Steve

[Malcolm McLeod]

Heh heh, I could save a hell of a lot if I bought magazine subscriptions, instead of just buying them willy-nilly...I would be prepared to make a random donation every now and again for the benefit of all, but not a formal subscription. I feel that to actually make enough to make it worthwhile, you really need quite a big site...and then you lose some of what makes this site so good!

[beowulf]

Steve,
Congratulations on a wonderful site. I pay $200 + to enter a race meeting, I hate to think how much I spend on motorsport over a season. $50 is money well spent. Hell I would pay that for Russ's comments alone. Great site, just so much knowledge.

[librules]

I'm in as well. The quality and quantity of pics, let alone discussions on various cars/drivers etc makes it a must. It's one of my favourite sites along with TNF. $50 or so is nothing compared to what I spend on mags and books annually..............

[Noo Noo]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the support. The biggest issue in making this a pay subscription site is not the guys who've said they won't pay, but the people who've not said anything at all. Although there has been a good response both on here and through private emails to me from those happy to pay, there hasn't been nearly enough response for me to know if by taking that step I won't jeopardize the site. Even though in a way I have nothing to lose by trying it, given the site really doesn't generate any income, I've put nearly 2 years of work into it, and I don't really want to risk that.

So at this stage I'll need to build the finances through other means, such as advertising, and the offer made by John at SPR Models, which itself could prove quite beneficial if enough people get in behind it.

Steve

It's over 19 months since the last post on this matter and I'm curious about how you've got on.
I visit TRS every day, get a lot from it and are quite prepared to put my hand in my pocket (or in my wife's handbag) to help keep it going if necessary. I'd be very upset if the site folded.

Anyway, just asking for an update.

David Hunter