Bobbys Camaro

[Steve Holmes]

9503

A slight detour here from the usual theme of this website, but stay with me, I haven’t taken a complete leave of my senses.....yet. It was my good buddy Bruce Thompson who told me about this movie, Aloha Bobby And Rose. It’s a road movie, touted at the time as something of a modern day (it was released in 1975) Bonnie And Clyde. I certainly wouldn’t go that far, and probably wouldn’t watch the movie for its story line. That being said, it was one of the highest grossing American films in 1975, despite being made on a budget of just $60,000. So obviously, there are plenty who loved the film more than I. But the real star, is the Camaro used throughout. This is why I’ve watched it as many times as I have.

Paul Le Mat (John Milner in American Graffiti) gets the lead in this flick. Hes the one who, in the movie, drives the Camaro. Being a car guy, I don’t think the Camaro gets enough air-time, but I would say that! There are a few scenes early in the movie where its put through its paces down Van Nuys Blvd, but I would have loved to have seen more.

From the first time I saw it, I became fascinated by that Camaro. Unlike Le Mats other famous ride, his “piss yellow deuce coupe” in AG, there seems to be very little information available about the Camaro. The vague info I’ve been able to gather, is that the car is a ’67 Camaro updated with ’68 doors and nose. It runs Ansen wheels, and quad-Webers on a 302ci small block. If that’s the case, its possibly a genuine Z28. The motor was said to have been built by Traco.

What I’ve read about the Camaro is that it was originally built up by/for James Garner, to run in the Trans-Am series and/or A-Sedan racing. Is this true? It does have a full rollcage, which Le Mat was quoted as saying was a pain climbing over getting in and out of the car. Garner was running his American International Racing (AIR) team at this time. They raced Lola T70 MkIII coupes and Corvettes. The ‘Vettes, I believe, they built themselves, so you’d think if they were going to race a Camaro, they’d also build that themselves, rather than farming the work out. While there are plenty of photos and info on the AIR Corvettes and Lolas, and some of the other cars the team raced, there is no mention of a Camaro.

The flares the car wore in the movie wouldn’t have been allowed in the Trans-Am, at least not when this car was new. The side pipes would likely have been a later addition also. So, whats the story with this car? Was it really built by AIR? Was it built specifically for Aloha Bobby And Rose? Or was it a street racer that was found and purchased for the movie?

My understanding is that Paul Le Mat now owns the Camaro.

[Steve Holmes]

Couple of excerpts from the movie:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKo-gpcxbo4

[Steve Holmes]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWiECcLEJTQ

[bry3500]

Interesting link here Steve - 52 pages of them :) http://www.imcdb.org/vehicles_make-Chevrolet_model-Camaro.html

[bry3500]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqHTXirrIlo

[Steve Holmes]

Yeah Bry, that car movie website is great isn't it!

[Steve Holmes]

A link posted on another thread about whether 1st gen Pontiac Firebirds were fitted with Chevy motors reminds me of the brilliant book Muscle Car Confidential, by Joe Oldham. In it he tested a new '68 Firebird PFST (Sprint Turismo). The car sat quite low, as there were possible plans to homologate some parts from it for the Trans-Am racing Firebirds, so it had to have a Trans-Am style road racing ground hugging stance to make that connection. Oldham he took it along to the local street racing (illegal drag racing) one evening to see what the racers all thought. They felt the car sat too low. They built their cars to sit tall on their suspension, like a drag car. Looking at the Camaro above from the Bobby And Rose flick, it too sits very low, which also makes me think it was possibly built originally for track racing, as it didn't follow the street trends of the time.

[stirlingmac]

Cool car and I loved the movie...I saw it as a wide eyed 10 yr old in Nelson at movies... From what I've read there were two cars built and one was definately a very fast car. Rick Figari the guy who also owns the Graffiti 32' and 55' has the feature Camaro as well , that being the car that was used for close ups and main scenes.

[Rod Grimwood]

Air cleaner does not look like it is on Quad-Webers ?

[Kiwiboss]

Forget the air cleaner/webers guys, open your eye's and look at that beautiful 69 grabber yellow Boss 302 in the back ground!! probably all of 2 grand back then!! in fact the front looks high so its most probably got the motor out!! arr the good old days!!

Dale M

[Bruce302]

I haven't watched the movie for a while, but from memory it didn't have the Webers until later .
Bruce.

[Steve Holmes]

The photo above appears to have been taken while the car was sitting on a used car sales lot, so perhaps a single 4-barrel had been swapped in. Then again, I've heard people talk about seeing it in the early '80s with the Webers, so Bruce is probably right, they could have been fitted later.

[Steve Holmes]

Forget the air cleaner/webers guys, open your eye's and look at that beautiful 69 grabber yellow Boss 302 in the back ground!! probably all of 2 grand back them!! in fact the front looks high so its most probably got the motor out!! arr the good old days!!

Dale M

Spoken like a true Ford guy!

[Jon Mello]

Steve,

That car lot was called Performance Classics and was in Eagle Rock, CA between Glendale and Pasadena. It was owned by my friend Dave Miller. Dave tells me he was selling the car for the movie company. The car was a '67, not a '68. It was being sold on ebay in 2004 and I recorded the VIN number from the ad at that time.

"Eat My Dust" starring Ron Howard is another fun movie from the '70s that featured an early Camaro getting into high speed shenanigans.

[Rod Grimwood]

I know of one back here in the 70s that got upto shenanigans as well (never made the movies/tv thank god) must have been normal for them.

[mid-year]

AIR,s workshop was an ex Hughes Corporation Quonset building located in Culver City California. The two L-88 Corvettes were the
first actual 1968 L-88,s built by the factory and were picked up and driven to AIR and modified for racing in house, so they certainly had the knowledge and staff to build the Camaro to Trans Am spec.9512

[Steve Holmes]

Some great info on the AIR Corvettes mid-year. What book is that scan from? And yes, I'd agree, they had the resources to build a Camaro race car had they felt the need to do so.

[Steve Holmes]

Steve,

That car lot was called Performance Classics and was in Eagle Rock, CA between Glendale and Pasadena. It was owned by my friend Dave Miller. Dave tells me he was selling the car for the movie company. The car was a '67, not a '68. It was being sold on ebay in 2004 and I recorded the VIN number from the ad at that time.

"Eat My Dust" starring Ron Howard is another fun movie from the '70s that featured an early Camaro getting into high speed shenanigans.

Hi there Jon, thanks for that info. I'd imagine Performance Classics had a steady stream of wide eyed teenagers stopping by to ogle. I love seeing photos from these places. I stumbled upon another photo of the Camaro pictured with a black '69 Camaro with very similar bodywork styling treatment. Not quite sure what the connection was, but interesting none the less. Jon, was the car a genuine Z28?

Yes, I have a copy of Eat My Dust. Not exactly a classic! But entertaining. Possibly one Ron Howard would prefer to forget. The Camaro in that movie was a curious mix of various styles. Has a full cage, blanked out grill, but heavy wheel arch flaring, so definitely not a short track dirt car as it was portrayed in the movie. Do you know anything about this car?

9513

[Jon Mello]

Steve,

I assume the car below is the other one you are talking about from Performance Classics. I don't know much about it but have asked my friend Dave. He has yet to get back to me.

The red "Aloha" car was not a Z-28. I am a skeptic also when it comes to the possibility that James Garner and AIR had anything to do with it. Garner ran Corvettes at the first race of the '68 season (Daytona 24hr) and then quickly sold them off to run a pair of Lola coupes for Sebring. He also ran an open wheel car with Scooter Patrick driving. Soon after, he concentrated his efforts on off-road racing with some Olds-powered Cutlass specials. There is not one entry in any of the Trans-Am events of the '67-'72 timeframe where AIR or James Garner is listed as an entrant with a Camaro. I've seen a lot of A-Sedan programs as well and never seen that sort of entry either.

As for the "Eat My Dust" car, I believe it is a '67 and not a '68 but other than that, I don't have much other information on it.

[mid-year]

Some great info on the AIR Corvettes mid-year. What book is that scan from? And yes, I'd agree, they had the resources to build a Camaro race car had they felt the need to do so.

Corvette Racing Legends ...author,Giminez

[Jon Mello]

OK, I got some information from my friend Dave Miller. He says...

"I kept that for the next 10 years. I leased it to a friend I met in Santa Maria after my relocation, and he and his pals repainted it and put in an Enderle injected SBC. It took first place at a big car show in Fresno, 8 foot tall trophy which my friend still has, then it was featured in Super Chevy or Popular Hot Rodding, and a cover car on Car Craft, all in the mid 80's. It sold for a nominal sum in 1986 at an auction in the bay area. I heard a rumor that Reggie Jackson eventually bought it, but I have never bothered to confirm that.

I mentioned to Dave that the Aloha Bobby and Rose car and the black car with the round tail lights had a similar style to them and he told me... "Both cars were built by the same person, the late Dan McLaughlin. Do some research on Dan and you'll find he owned American International Racing after Jim Garner and his buddies. Dan was mostly associated with Porsches, but in the late 1970's he built some radical "canyon racers" (read Mullholland Drive) and those two were part of a trio."

Apparently each car was stamped with a number, 1, 2 or 3. Dave thinks the black car was #1, the Aloha car #2 or #3; not sure which. Anyway, the cars were built by Dan McLaughlin and his AIR company. James Garner did not have anything to do with them other than the fact that McLaughlin acquired the rights to use the AIR name from Garner.

[Steve Holmes]

Jon, you're a legend! Thats the best info I've ever read about this car. Just fantastic! Thank you. And yes, thats the black '69 I was referring to. I hadn't seen a rear shot of it before, looks like they've grafted a '70 tail light panel in there plus '70 rear spoiler.

Did Dave happen to mention if the Bobby & Rose Camaro was ever intended for anything other than street use?

I can now see how the confusion came about that the Camaro was built for James Garner, given Dan McLauchlin later owned AIR. Like you, I'd searched old race results and never found any reference to Garner racing a Camaro, or a Camaro even being run by AIR with someone else driving, as was the case with the Lola's.

I wonder if that black '69 still exists?

[Jon Mello]

Steve, I had somebody call me their Street Hero one time but I've never been called a legend, except for in my own mind. Actually, Dave Miller is the guy with all the answers and I am just fortunate enough to know him and be able to pass along what he has told me. The black car was not a '69 but did have a '69 grille customized to fit on the car.

There is more information about Dan McLaughlin at this link... http://www.imsahistory.com/Articles4/AIR.html

When you read about him you can understand about his talents and why these cars were flared and customized like they were.

[Jon Mello]

If you've got nothing but time on your hands, here is a link to a thread about Mullholland drive and the cars that terrorized that stretch of road trying to be "King of the Hill". Largely Porsche info but other stuff too if you keep looking.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/off-topic-discussions/323773-what-happened-mulholland-king-hill-rsr.html

[Bruce302]

This is one of the pics that was used on the Ebay sale a while back. One website reported that Paul Le Mat bought the car.

http://i49.tinypic.com/fa8piq.jpg
Bruce.

[Steve Holmes]

Steve, I had somebody call me their Street Hero one time but I've never been called a legend, except for in my own mind. Actually, Dave Miller is the guy with all the answers and I am just fortunate enough to know him and be able to pass along what he has told me. The black car was not a '69 but did have a '69 grille customized to fit on the car.

There is more information about Dan McLaughlin at this link... http://www.imsahistory.com/Articles4/AIR.html

When you read about him you can understand about his talents and why these cars were flared and customized like they were.

Wow, great info Jon. So are the flares on the Bobby Camaro fibreglass? I did read somewhere that they were, but I just assumed they were steel.

What the heck is a Street Hero? This sounds fascinating!

[Steve Holmes]

If you've got nothing but time on your hands, here is a link to a thread about Mullholland drive and the cars that terrorized that stretch of road trying to be "King of the Hill". Largely Porsche info but other stuff too if you keep looking.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/off-topic-discussions/323773-what-happened-mulholland-king-hill-rsr.html

Fantastic! You'll enjoy these ones Jon, some amazing photos and stories from various street cruising/racing scenes in the '70s, this is mostly ponycar/muscle car/hot rod stuff:

http://upintherear.tumblr.com/

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=671112

[Jon Mello]

Steve, the "Street Hero" name came about after I took a friend around town in my '67 Camaro at the time and I was doing controlled drifts through some of the turns on the city streets. Not the smartest of thing to do but the car handled very predictably and it was just something fun. When you're young, you do impulsive stuff like that. Anyway, my friend was impressed and tossed that label on me. I was never a "jacked up in the rear" guy but those links bring back some memories from a time that I was very much a part of. Thanks for posting them.

P.S. The flares were done in steel.

[Steve Holmes]

Jon, great story, I love it! It definitely suits you. And you were only doing what everyone else was doing during that decade. Do you have any photos of the Camaro you had at the time?

Check these guys out, they don't look like they're fully in control of the situation, but its fun to watch:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=uwaPAIqcjJM

[Steve Holmes]

Hows this for taking the whole "up in the rear" trend to the extremes! That Torino must be an adventure on any corner at any speed:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWMBB_uj5iM&feature=player_embedded

[Jon Mello]

Steve, there is a difference between me and the guys in the video. I did not do crazy stuff in the same neighborhood that I lived in. Here is a photo of the red car I had at the time of the Street Hero moniker. Doesn't look like much but I had a good time with it.

I remember a '65 Chevelle a few blocks away from my parents that had the back end way up in the air. I am 6' 4" tall and the top of the trunk lid was above my shoulders.

[Rod Grimwood]

Then the front end collapse's and they wonder 'why'. Imagine the loading on the bottom ball joints and the steering ends etc.

[Steve Holmes]

Steve, there is a difference between me and the guys in the video. I did not do crazy stuff in the same neighborhood that I lived in.

Jon, that line right there is an instant classic! I'll have to remember to use that myself. Thanks so much for posting the pics of your Camaro. What a fabulous car. Looks like a 4-speed. This must have been fun. I know every young guy had a cool car then and they were pretty cheap and plentiful, but its nice to see your road racing rootes were already strong, as many cars of the era took on the drag racing stance.

[Steve Holmes]

Jon, I saw this posted over at the Jalopy Journal: http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=713898

Could this be the black/dark blue car you posted earlier? The flares look similar, and it has the '70 Camaro 3-piece rear spoiler.

9627

[Bruce302]

Needs more tyre

[Jon Mello]

Steve,

Yes, that's the same car that was black on the Performance Classics car lot. According to Dave Miller, the car had a Traco 302 in it when it was black and the hood was a true GM fiberglass crossram hood also. In the photo above, the car has an Enderle injected 350 in it. Subsequently, some pin striping and minor graphics in gold leaf were later added, and then it won first place at a show called Blackie's in Fresno. This was back in the mid-1980s.

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks Jon, great info. Boy thats a wild car! What sort of wheels are those Jon? They must be 15" wide at the rear!

[Jon Mello]

They are American 5-spokes all the way around. Dave Miller says they were either 15"x12" or 15"x14", he can't remember for sure.

[zombie289]

Steve,

That car lot was called Performance Classics and was in Eagle Rock, CA between Glendale and Pasadena. It was owned by my friend Dave Miller. Dave tells me he was selling the car for the movie company. The car was a '67, not a '68. It was being sold on ebay in 2004 and I recorded the VIN number from the ad at that time.

"Eat My Dust" starring Ron Howard is another fun movie from the '70s that featured an early Camaro getting into high speed shenanigans.

Hey Jon, where abouts in eagle rock?? I work in Glendale... Always curious about where this stuff used to be..

[Jon Mello]

I believe it was 2125 Colorado Blvd.

[Steve Holmes]

Another great photo there Jon, thanks for sharing. Got any more?

[Jon Mello]

Sorry, Steve. I don't have any other photos to share at this time.

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks Jon.

[zombie289]

I believe it was 2125 Colorado Blvd.
Thanks John... and here it is today... 9704

[Steve Holmes]

Hey Pauly, thanks for posting that. Did you take that photo? Its neat to see some of these places and how they look today. Looks like the front fence is the same, but other than that theres no evidence of what was once there.

Hot Rod Deluxe magazine do a regular feature where they run photos of an important historical place or building relating to hot rodding history, then they show what that place looks like today. It can actually be a little depressing to see!

[Steve Holmes]

An illustration I quickly put together for one of the magazines I write for, as I was (and still am) convinced that as there is such huge interest in traditional hot rodding, and building cars in a style to what was built in the '40s, '50s, and '60s, that this would eventually extend and '70s fashion would make a come back also.

9738

[zombie289]

Hey Pauly, thanks for posting that. Did you take that photo? Its neat to see some of these places and how they look today. Looks like the front fence is the same, but other than that theres no evidence of what was once there.

Hot Rod Deluxe magazine do a regular feature where they run photos of an important historical place or building relating to hot rodding history, then they show what that place looks like today. It can actually be a little depressing to see!

Nah steve got it from a mapsite on the interwebs, although I have driven past it several times on the way home from work (not knowing what it formally was!) when the 210 freeway is clogged....

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks Pauly. Its interesting, that place looks so completely antonymous now, so different to what it once was.

[zombie289]

Its amazing steve how many places i've driven past around here and my friends will say that used to be blah blah blah... its a real trip... In fact across the street from my workplace is the old Navarro engineering shop... Im glad I got to see it before the new owners remodeled and repainted it. Sorry to to drag this one off topic! :)

[Steve Holmes]

Nah, not off topic. I love unearthing the history of places. How different is the old Navarro building now?

[zombie289]

Its the same building steve, just repainted and cleaned up inside... when it was for sale my friend and I got to go in there and although it was empty, you got the vibe that there was some special things that happened in that place..

[Steve Holmes]

Yeah I know exactly what you mean Pauly, places like that have a vibe.

[Jon Mello]

Steve,

I just got two more photos of the red (formerly black) car from Dave Miller. The rear spoiler says Santa Maria Muffler on it. It appears to be a '67 Camaro dash pad that I see through the windshield hence I bet this car also began life as a '67 Camaro like the Aloha car did. This car also appears to have had air conditioning when new based on the black rectangular hole seen on top of the cowl in front of the chromed cowl panel.

-Jon

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks so much Jon, what wonderful photos! There has been so much work go into that car, its really impressive. Looks like they've fit a '69 nose to it, so I assume that must also include the front fenders. There are no quarter windows in the doors so would they have replaced the doors also? I thought at first they'd grafted in a '70 Camaro tail light panel, but I think maybe that panel was made from scratch. Thanks again for posting these Jon.

[Jon Mello]

Steve,

The whole car is so customized that it's hard to say but I suspect the doors are from a '69 to blend better with the '69 front fenders. The backs of the '69 doors to not have the sharp crease in the middle like the earlier doors so that's why the rear quarters would have required some modification. I agree that the rear panel is custom and not something grafted from a '70 model. Just FYI, Dave Miller sold this car at auction in 1986 and has not seen or heard of it since. I'd think it still survives but can't say that for certain.

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks again Jon. I wonder why they didn't just start with a '69? It'd be nice to know if it still exists. Hopefully its sitting quietly in the corner of someones garage.

[Lindsay G]

Steve I always loved that Camaro too .This clip isn't the original but a bloody good replica and the flares are a bit more subtle but it looks and sounds just right.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUJQXgO0ioo

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks Lindsay, yeah that is a cool tribute car. I'd love to know where the original is now. I believe it still exists.

[Lindsay G]

Thanks Lindsay, yeah that is a cool tribute car. I'd love to know where the original is now. I believe it still exists.

Yeah I'm sure I've seen a video of Paul Le Mat talking with the current owner who also owns the Graffitti coupe.haven't been able to find it but heres another Aloha clip.Not a lot of the car but it has a shot under the bonnet showing its got a four barrel for the movie anyway.And I really like the song.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qX-uwMKd5k

[Steve Holmes]

Cool vid there Lindsay. Isn't that Camaro tough! It was put through its paces briefly early on in the movie, I would have liked it if they'd had more street racing scenes.

[fieldsken1]

Cool vid there Lindsay. Isn't that Camaro tough! It was put through its paces briefly early on in the movie, I would have liked it if they'd had more street racing scenes.

heres a few pictures of that car. i brought rthe black one and a friend uni brought the red one then sold it later

[Steve Holmes]

Wow, that is one heck of a cool first post! Thanks for the Images and info. Such a tough pair of cars. Do you know where either are today?

[fieldsken1]

i brought the black one and a friend uni brought the red one. the red one ended up with someone in burbank and i sold mine to someone in the LA area. years later one of them ended up on the cover of car craft mag. i think it was mine?? years later i moved to seattle and i saw one driving down the freeway in seattle. i got the guy to pull over and he said he brought it from someone the the LA area?? i was shocked. i offered to buy it and he said no way. last i have ever seen them..

yeah it was moine the black one

[fieldsken1]

fooses father designed the cars but i cant remember who built them