Etceterini; Small Italian race cars built from 1937 to 1965

[khyndart in CA]

Cliff Reuter gave me permission to enter the Jerry Melton photo collection here on TRS.
He has been pleased with how they have been presented and received and now has given me the OK to attempt to input some of his vast resources and knowledge on the Etceterini collection.
By definition etceterinis are hand made small displacement Italian racing cars which were produced from the late 1940's to the early 1960's. Most of these beautiful cars used Fiat running gear and had their own chassis, hand hammered aluminum bodies, and engines. They raced throughout Europe in races such as the legendary Mille Miglia and also competed heavily in American SCCA racing.
In general, Etceterinis were raced in only two places; in Italy and post war, in the U.S. In Italy to compete in the Italian Championship for sportscars, and in the U.S. to find success in the SCCA’s H modified classes, for many years limited to 750 cc. G modified classes accommodated 1100cc sports racers and there too, one would find a variety of Bandinis, Abarths, and Nardis.
Some etceterini examples.
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( Ken H )

[Ray Bell]

The underpinnings of Formula Junior there?

When the desire to race is strong and the wallet is skinny, there has to be an answer and this was obviously one answer.

Keep 'em coming...

[Oldfart]

Cliff Reuter's site is great reading for the fans of "mobile chicanes".

[khyndart in CA]

There were at least 84 different constructors of small displacement racing cars to compete in the Italian National Championship races. . Etcetera, from which the word Etceterini is derived, means ‘and so on’ or ‘and the like’.
I can't cover each constructor but will enter some when time permits. (I am off to get my beauty sleep before the All Black V England game starting at 1 am our time !)
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(Ken H)

[Roger Dowding]

Ken H .. Etcetera Etceterini .. The All Blacks play 9;00 pm in Aotearoa - the broadcast is on free to air TV and starts at 7;00pm with a lot of preamble - hope I last long enough !! .

The Kiwitahi connection - sent you an Email - will send John Mitchinson [ Mitchison ] a copy of that School List..
The Small world thing - you have dealings with Eric that I met in California in 1982 and your brother was in the same class as John - my companion at Pukekohe and neighbour .. Cheers
Roger

[khyndart in CA]

Some Etceterini vehicles on the historic Mille Miglia course 2010-2011.
Beautifully shown in these Hugues Vanhoolandt photos.
Notice how large the occupants appear in these tiny Italian racers !
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(Ken H)

[Roger Dowding]

Ken H .. Etcetera Etceterini .. The All Blacks play 9;00 pm in Aotearoa - the broadcast is on free to air TV and starts at 7;00pm with a lot of preamble - hope I last long enough !! .

The Kiwitahi connection - sent you an Email - will send John Mitchinson [ Mitchison ] a copy of that School List..
The Small world thing - you have dealings with Eric that I met in California in 1982 and your brother was in the same class as John - my companion at Pukekohe and neighbour .. Cheers
Roger

Pity about the result Ab's vs my Fathers Team = England .. hope you got to get back to sleep - I did manage to stay the distance here in NZ ..

[khyndart in CA]

Cliff Reuter writes; " This magnificent Bandini was produced by the legendary Ilario Bandini. Bandini lovingly created 75 cars by hand from 1946 until 1986. The Siluro (torpedo) had removable fenders and was therefore eligible for both the Italian formula 3 series (open wheel 750 cc) and sports car races such as the Mille Miglia. These little cars also raced in America where they won the SCCA class H Modified national championship in 1955 and 1957. Jack Reuter has owned this example for over 20 years. It features a Bandini 750cc DOHC engine. It is all original".
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Ilario Bandini driving his 750 Siluro in 1956.
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An early Bandini 750 engine.
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A beautiful wee car from any angle.
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(Ken H )

[Roger Dowding]

Ken,
" Bandini 750cc DOHC engine. " That is brilliant - and look at that engine - twincam with style .. Testa Rossa = Red Head.

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Makes a more Modern take look bland - Bandini has those Glorious Webers hanging off the side of it - compared to all complexities of EFI. 1989 on ..

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[Ray Bell]

The valve angle is obviously 'old school' and extreme compared to modern engines...

But anyone who does that sort of thing is worthy of commendation.

[khyndart in CA]

The second Bandini Siluro built in 1947 now beautifully restored. "The Italian Torpedo".
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( 2008 Autoweek article.)

[khyndart in CA]

Only in America !
Not all Bandini Siluros had 750 cc engines as seen here in these 1961 scenes of a slightly modified 1954 Bandini.
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One would have to be brave with the lack of safety features etc. to drive this little beast !

(Ken H )

[Roger Dowding]

" Cut and Shut " Nah !! " Cut and stretched " - what a sad fate for a beautiful little car .. but then where else in the world would a single seater Ferrari GP car become a Corvette powered Morris Minor Special ?? Allcomer Saloon
-he was only travelling in a " sort of " straight line.
Where do you find this stuff Ken H ??- supposed to be working I thought .. he he ..

[bry3500]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_EuVzTiTTM

[khyndart in CA]

Give me a break Roger, I get off at 4 pm and did this at about 4.15 pm. CA time.
I'l be 71 in 3 weeks and you guys are all retired, playing lawn bowls, darts or down at the pub,while I struggle away over here trying to put food on the table,so back off. OK.:cool: (Just kidding Roger.)

Anyway here is another Bandini Special.
1953 Bandini Siluro MG 1250cc "Uihlein Special"

The David V. Uihlein Special
" David Uihlein was a sports car enthusiast living in Wisconsin. At the age of 16 he landed a summer job in the Milwaukee shop of racing legends Carl and Tudy Marchese. Following his formal education and an apprenticeship at the family brewing business (Schlitz),
The Uihlein XPAG twin cam engine
The interesting part about the Uihlein special is its engine. The bottom end is an MG TD 1250-cc XPAG unit, chosen for its reliability and also because it was significantly less expensive than an Offy engine. On top of this block sits a hemispherical head with dual overhead camshafts. The head and cam housings are cast in nickel-alloy steel. The stock cam was left in the block to drive the oil pump and distributor while the two overhead camshafts are gear driven. Dual S.U. carburetors feed the fuel mixture to the intake ports on the left side while four ports lead to four straight pipes on the right side of the engine. The hemispherical head allows valves that are approximately 40 percent larger than original. Published reports of the time claimed the Uihlein engine would produce 90-bhp, significantly more than the 54-bhp of a standard XPAG engine, although the compression ratio was not reported. Don Marsh, a Columbus, Ohio racer who drove MGs in the early 1950s remembers seeing the bright purple Uihlein special at a race at Cumberland in the mid-fifties. We were pretty worried about it, with its special engine. But it wasnt very fast and we had no trouble beating it.

David Uihleins intention was to offer a competition model built in Milwaukee to customers and to also provide the twin-cam head in kit form so that others could build their own twin-cam T-types. Neither plan came to fruition. "

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[khyndart in CA]

Some comparison photos of a 1960 "Birdcage" Maserati and a beautiful 1955 Bandini Siluro owned by the Reuter family.
(Cliff Reuter photos )
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(Note the tyre width difference )



(Ken H)

[Roger Dowding]

" Give me a break Roger, I get off at 4 pm and did this at about 4.15 pm. CA time.
I'l be 71 in 3 weeks and you guys are all retired, playing lawn bowls, darts or down at the pub,while I struggle away over here trying to put food on the table,so back off. OK. (Just kidding Roger.) "

All good Mate

Ken H - I clocked 72 last month and as of today 1st November - have been retired for 5 years - so if you are still doing it -
" what you enjoy "- at 71 Good on You - my last couple of years of work were hard - the people were mainly good but the Corporate Bulldust was not .. My occupation these days [ apart from the Motoring Archives - unpaid ] - is a bit of dog minding and lawnmowing for a lady who travels a bit - pocket money not wages.

Cheers from NZ
Roger D

as the post #15 is full of engines here is another one -not Italian though.

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[khyndart in CA]

The Bandini Siluro was an early race car for a young Mark Donohue about 1960. Note it is RHD and has a special roll bar.
I found this comment about this car.
"1. stephen griswold says
August 26, 2010 at 12:09 pm
Thanks for the photo of Mark in the Bandini Siluro (Torpedo) that I used to own. I bought it from Bob Satava in Ohio years ago and Burge Hulette was one of the listed owners. The car was originally ordered by Hank Rudkin ( Pepperidge Farm Bakery) in Norwalk Conn. The car is easily recognized because it is the only RHD Siluro that was built and for the horrible roll bar ( seen in the picture) that was still on it when I bought it. Hank ordered the car without an engine and put a Crosley mounted to an MG TC gearbox in it after it arrived. Shortly thereafter he installed a 2 Cyl Saab to make it more competitive. I brought it to Europe and it now resides nearby in Desenzano del Garda. Had I know of its Donohue history I would have asked for more $$$$."

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The RHD Bandini before the roll bar.

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A young Mark Donohue with his Bandini Siluro in the background.


(Ken H )

[khyndart in CA]

In the US the need for more engines in the 750 cc SCCA class racing was met when Ilario Bandini and US industrialist Powel Crosley, Jr combined to produce some fascinating engines. The Bandini used both a modified single overhead cam almost stock looking Crosley and the highly modified dual overhead cam version where Bandini built the block and head assembly. Some reports are that the true Bandini Single Overhead cam engines also had a removable head like the dual engines and were 4 port intake.
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Crosley also built what was known as the "Tin Engine"
Crosley CoBra Engine 1945-1949

The post-war Crosley models were powered by an innovative four-cylinder, overhead-camshaft engine, originally designed by Lloyd M. Taylor during WW2 to run generators. Instead of being cast as most other engine blocks were, it was built up from an assembly of steel tubing and stampings. These parts were assembled in a jig, then copper brazed together at high temperatures. The copper brazing process gave the engine name, CoBra.

With a 2.5" bore and 2.25" stroke, engine displacement was 724cc, or 44 cubic inches. A vertical shaft with bevel gears was used to drive the overhead camshaft instead of a more conventional chain drive so that the lubricating oil could be fed up through it to pressure feed the cam bearings. The CoBra engine had a compression ratio of 7.5:1 making 26 horsepower at 5200 RPM.

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Read more at this site.; http://crosleyautoclub.com/Mighty_Tin.html




(Ken H.. )

[khyndart in CA]

The Crosley engine continued.
Crosley CIBA Engine 1949-1952

In 1949, the Cobra engine was replaced by the new and more reliable CIBA (Cast Iron Block Assembly), a water-cooled inline-four cylinder engine utilizing five main bearings. Displacement was 44 cubic-inches, or 724cc.
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Throughout the early fifties, Crosley cars dominated 750cc sports car racing, winning 10 out of 12 SCCA west-coast races alone. A Crosley HotShot also won the 1950 Sebring endurance race, an event that used a formula to measure cars against each other based on engine displacement. After six hours of racing, a stripped-down HotShot finished ahead of others in its class with an average speed of 52 mph ! (Wow )
1949
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More Crosley CIBA engine information.
http://crosleyautoclub.com/EngineTree/Crosley_Eng_Tree-2.html

A Bandini Siluro with a Crosley also did well at Vero Beach, Florida, in 1955.
(Ernie McAfee was a popular driver here at the local Santa Barbara Airport races.)
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(Ken H)

[Ray Bell]

This thread doesn't get the attention it should, Ken...

A real shame, these are very interesting cars by their very nature.

[Roger Dowding]

This thread doesn't get the attention it should, Ken...

A real shame, these are very interesting cars by their very nature.

Ray Bell agree .. Both You and I like it, cheers.

Thanks Ken H for the " inputs " too !!

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As they do in Facebook Land .. Like - like ..

[khyndart in CA]

Thanks for the encouragement Gentlemen.
They may not have been the fastest cars on the tracks but they were certainly interesting and I am enjoying the research and trying to make the photos presentable etc. etc. on a subject I knew "zilch" about when I started and especially thanks to Cliff Reuter's encouragement.
I hate to disappoint you but there is a whole lot more to come and if you watch all the film clips you may have learnt the Italian language by the end of the thread !

But often waiting to overcome "THIS IS NOT A SECURE SITE" and having to reload again can be a real pain and I hope a permanent fix can be found really soon !
I would hate to think that all this wonderful "stuff" could be suddenly lost.
I have faith in you Steve.:cool:

(Ken H)

[Kwaussie]

Enjoy this thread very much Ken, love the photos and text. The little cars are like jewels!
Keep up the good work. Much appreciated.

[khyndart in CA]

Bandini Formula Junior.
The Formula Junior class was introduced in 1959. The formula was a junior category designed at first for Europe and United States to start young drivers racing careers. For this reason, the technical regulation contained rules that restricted the project costs and operational expenses. In an effort to flatten the differences between different cars, engines had to come from auto series produced in a large number of units and they were also only allowed limited alterations. The choice for Bandini, as well as that of many other European cars was the Fiat 1100 / 103 engine.
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Ilario Bandini preparing a Fiat engine for his FJ racer.
The engine Fiat 1100/103 is inclined along the longitudinal axis of 15 °, allowing positioning at the center of chassis for better weight distribution

Positioning: forward longitudinal, 4-cylinder in-line tilted 15 °
Bore: 68 mm (2.7 in)
Stroke: 75 mm (3.0 in)
Displacement: 1089.5 cc
Compression ratio: 9.8:1
Power: 2 carburettors Weber 38DCOE body double / 40DCOE
Power: 90 hp (67 kW) @ 6900 rpm
Lubricate: Carter wet with pump gear.
It was a good looking car.
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(Ken H )

[khyndart in CA]

A restored 1959 Bandini Formula Junior YouTube clip.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-tXTYWb5MI



(Ken H)

[Roger Dowding]

An Italian FJ in New Zealand ... does this qualify for Etceterini ?? ..Please focus on the FJ not the home grown Car ..Ardmore 1989 the Reunion Meeting ..

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Volpini ?... Colin Waite was there with his Stanguellini too !! .. no photo though !!

[Ray Bell]

I don't know so much about 'limited alterations'...

Manifolding and carburetion were free (though injection wasn't allowed), from memory the stroke had to be standard but they could be bored or sleeved, any form of modification to the head was allowed as long as you didn't add material, camshafts were free, all reciprocating and rotating parts were free.

I think it started in Italy before 1959, too. It went big Internationally in 1960.

Count Johnny Lurani was behind it as I recall.

[khyndart in CA]

A bit more regarding Formula Junior.
" Formula Junior is an open wheel formula racing class first adopted in October 1958 by the CSI (International Sporting Commission, the part of the FIA that then regulated motorsports).
The rules for the class required the cars to be powered by production-based engines with a maximum volume of 1000 cc with a 360 kg (792 lb) car or 1100 cc with a 400 kg (880 lb) car – in practice the latter was used in almost all successful FJs (the USA adopted other cc/weight ratios but they were rarely used). Parts like engine block, head and cylinders had to come from a production car; single or twin overhead camshafts, limited slip differentials and modifications to the number of main bearings were all forbidden. The brakes and transmission also had to be production-based. Constructors were allowed to increase the number of gears, but only inside a production gearbox casing. In Italy the popular Fiat 1100 engine was the obvious choice and in 1958 there were few other suitable engines in Italy; elsewhere the 1000 cc Mini engine as well as the DKW and the Saab three-cylinder two-stroke engines were obvious choices, as was the new over square Ford engine from the 105E Anglia. The first Italian FJ cars were very much in the front-engined tradition of contemporary Grand Prix cars; the first international Formula Junior championship in 1959 was won by the Swiss driver and engineer Michael May in an Automobili Stanguellini. "
(As per Wikipedia.org ).

[khyndart in CA]

I thought Italian driver Lorenzo Bandini would have been related to Ilario Bandini and driven the Bandini FJ in his early days of racing but he was not related and instead drove Volpini and Stanguellini FJ race cars to his early successes.
Lorenzo did get to give Ilario an award in 1964 for his contribution to motor racing as a constructor, designer, race driver like Jack Brabham and Bruce McLaren.
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Lorenzo Bandini on (R) presenting Ilario Bandini with an award in 1964.

Early in his career Lorenzo came out to NZ for the 1962 Grand Prix at Ardmore and I noted this in the race programme.
" He speaks good English !"
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Sadly this popular driver was to die from injuries 3 days after a horrible accident during the 1967 Monaco F1 Grand Prix. May 1967.
http://theinsideline.com/story/maurice-hamilton-bandini-s-fatal-afternoon


(Ken H)

[Ray Bell]

I think he actually lingered for three weeks after that accident at Monaco...

His death was, as I recall, the first of a string of F1 tragedies. Bob Anderson, Jo Bonnier, Jim Clark, Mike Spence, Bruce and others kept us all wondering about why we follow the sport.

It must have been galling, when you think about it, that the introduction of FJr didn't lead to domination by an Italian engine. Johnny Lurani could easily have surmised that the Fiat 1100 donk would be superior to anything else about, and it was pretty good. It was the right size and it had an alloy head with decent porting, and it had a good history of being 'tuned' by a variety of Italian engine builders.

French prospects were minimal, Renault's engines were still a bit on the small side and neither Peugeot or Citroen built anything that small. Apart from the 2CV, of course, and that would have been a real laugh. Simcas were based on the Fiat anyway, but were already enlarged to 1300cc. Germany didn't have much to offer.

The Poms had the A-series lump to work with, and they were to work it hard, but nothing else. Until a few weeks after the International acceptance of the formula was announced and then the 105E came on the scene.

[khyndart in CA]

A copy of the first Formula Junior guidelines as per Count Johnny Lurani. October 1958.
(Reading glasses required.)

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[khyndart in CA]

Lorenzo Bandini in his Cooper T 51 waiting at the pumps at Joel Wakely’s Boomerang Service Station at Concord,Sydney. Jan. 1962.
Is that Spencer Martin next to him in a Holden Special ?
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(Joel Wakely photo )



(Ken H)

[Ray Bell]

I'm pretty sure that's not Spencer in the Prad, Ken...

More likely Joel himself.

[Roger Dowding]

I'm pretty sure that's not Spencer in the Prad, Ken...

More likely Joel himself.

Who is in the Humpy FX FJ then ??

[khyndart in CA]

Perhaps that is the FX that Spencer drove for the "Boomerang Service Station"in 1963.
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Spencer in the ‘Boomerang Service Station’ Holden FX, Catalina Park, Katoomba 1963. It was consistent ‘giant killing’ performances against Norm Beechey and the like which attracted McKay to Martin. (Autopics.com.au Collection)

A good read here about Spencer Martin;
https://primotipo.com/2015/04/30/spencer-martin-australian-gold-star-champion-19667/

(Ken H)

[Ray Bell]

I'm not so sure Spencer ran against Beechey's early Holden more than once or twice...

But he dominated the special series held for these cars at Catalina Park.

Thinking back, I'm not sure when Spencer raced the Prad, either. I know Ross McNair had it after him. And I don't recall Spencer's Holden ever being anythiing other than the darker green with a yellow stripe.

[khyndart in CA]

Lorenzo Bandini first showed his driving talents in Formula Junior driving a Volpini FJ in 1959.

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( From a 1959 ad. )
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Showing the offset driving position.
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A 1959 Volpini FJ at Laguna Seca 2008.
(From the Cliff Reuter collection.)

(Ken H)

[Milan Fistonic]

Geoff Manning in his Volpini FJ at Whenuapai in 1994

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[khyndart in CA]

1958/59 Volpini Formula Junior #013 Geoff Manning collection.
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Some sources say it is a 1958 car and others say 1959 and I will say it is a 1958/1959 Volpini FJ beautifully restored.



From the 2013 Leadfoot Festival programme.
" 1958 Volpini Formula Junior – This car is one of just fifteen built. Chassis No’s 006 and 013 were the Volpini works cars, driven by Lorenzo Bandini, who went on to drive in Formula 1 for Ferrari. Bandini won the Italian Formula Junior Championship in 1959 with #013, including fourth place in Monaco. Count Johnny Lurani, the originator of the Formula Junior formula, then purchased the car. It spent the next three years as a ” Hire and Drive” racing car, years that included a spell of ice racing in Sweden. Lurani sold the car to Mr Lombardi in Genoa, northern Italy. His daughter Lella Bombardi, is still the only female Grand Prix driver to ever earn World Championship points. The car languished for a number of years, slowly falling into disrepair, until purchased in the mid- 1980s by Geoff and Barbara Manning. They brought it back to New Zealand where Geoff completely restored the car. It made its debut at the 1989 Ardmore Grand Prix re-union. Since then it has been raced in Historic meetings throughout New Zealand. It has won its class in the Thoroughbred & Classic Car Owners Club (TACCOC) Historic four times since 1990, driven by Geoff. Considering the Volpinis vintage with engine and drum brakes from the 1950s its 88 hp really does it proud. Perhaps the fact that it was designed by the great Gioacchino Columbo, who was responsible for the Alfa Romeo 158, among others, has something to do with the cars wonderfully handling characteristics. Geoff Manning built and raced specials in New Zealand before going to England in 1962. There he worked on historic, sports and racing cars, and for teams in Formula 1 and 2 and Group 6 sports cars, plus hillclimb and sprint cars. He built the awesome Cooper Chrysler with which Jonty Williamson won the 1970 British Sprint Championship. He worked as mechanic for Jaques Lafitte, Graham Hill, Bruce Mclaren, Chris Amon, Frank Williams, Ron Dennis (in Formula 2). He has prepared historic racing cars for Stirling Moss, John Harper, Richard Bond and Robert Cooper. He worked for the Ford competitions department in the 60s under Fords famous designer Len Bailey, and was chief mechanic for Bruce McLaren and Chris Amon in the team that won Le Mans with the GT40 in 1966. He was also involved with the development of the Mk. 1 Escort for racing. In 2004 Geoff and Barbara took the Volpini to Monaco for the Classic Grand Prix and an amazing achievement with Geoffs health failing. In 2005 the Volpini was sold to Allan Woolf and with its classic appearance attracts a lot of attention and great to drive."

I wonder if Geoff would have enjoyed seeing the new Ferrari versus Ford movie as he played such an important part back in 1966.
I have my own opinion about this movie beginning with the fact there were 3 Kiwi drivers of the 4 that were in the first and second Fords in 1966. See how much that is noted or how McLaren and Amon were cruising ahead by one minute when the first instructions went out to slow down for the photo finish fiasco.
But it was good to see a motor racing movie have some success over here.


(Ken H )

[khyndart in CA]

The later version of the 1959 Volpini FJ was not off set and a bit sleeker.
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The main USA Dealer for Italian Formula Junior racers in 1959.
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(Note who was in charge of the competition department.)


(Ken H )

[khyndart in CA]

Italian, Berardo Taraschi did an amazing job after WW 2 building cars using surplus war materials, that competed in the Sport 750 Category in the Targa Florio starting in 1948 with his 2 seater car named the "Uraina" model.
Uraina cars were built from 1947 to 1949 and were based on the Fiat 500 Topolino tubular chassis and had BMW motorcycle engines. Berardo Taraschi later merged these cars with Giannini engines to form Giaur.

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1947 750cc Sport BMW Boxer

He also produced a Formula 2 car in 1947 with a Roots supercharger and a 500 cc BMW engine.

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1947 500cc Supercharged F2 BMW Boxer


(Ken H )

[khyndart in CA]

The Taraschi cars over the years.
•Urania 750 Sport (1947)
•Urania 750 Sport (1948)
•Urania 500 F.2 Compressor (1948)
•Urania 500 rear engine (1949)
•Urania 750 Sport (1949)
Giaur •Giaur 750 Sport (1949)
•Giaur F3 500 (1949)
•Giaur 750 Berlinetta (1950)
•Giaur 750 Sports Champion (1953)
•Giaur 750 Berlinetta San Remo (1954)
•Giaur 750 Red Blitz (1954)
•Giaur 750 Record (1954)
•Giaur 750 Single Seater (1955)
•Giaur 750 Sport Record (1956)
•Giaur 750 Sport G2 (1958)
•Giaur 1100 Junior (1958)
Taraschi •Taraschi 1100 Junior De Dion (1958)
•Taraschi 1100 Junior independent suspension (1960)
•Taraschi 1100 Junior USA (1960)

Some Taraschi Urania photos.
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Famous Italian women driver Maria Teresa de Filippis competing in the 1950 Targa Florio in her Urania.

A short clip regarding Maria Teresa de Filippis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rK_W5wCZw9E


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Still attracting attention today from all ages.
(Cliff Reuter photos and the Taraschi collection.)


(Ken H)

[Ray Bell]

I love the optimism of those BMW rocker covers out in the breeze!

Which 750 engine did he use?

[khyndart in CA]

Ray,
Giaur was formed in 1950 by Berardo Taraschi (previously of Urania) and the Giannini brothers, the name coming from GIAnnini and URania. The engines were originally Giannini units, and Crosley engines were later used in America. They raced throughout Europe in races such as the legendary Mille Miglia and also competed heavily in American SCCA racing. Only 48 cars were made, 13 were the 750cc "Champion" which had removable fenders and were therefore eligible for both the Italian formula 3 series (open wheel 750 cc) and sportscar races. Only five Giaur Champions are known in the world today. Following the second world war Giannini continued to develop the small Fiat engines, especially the OHV unit from the 500B. They then went on to develop their own engines, first the G1, a sohc 660cc and later the G2 which was a dohc 750cc.
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A Giannini 750cc dohc G2 engine.

(Ken H)

[khyndart in CA]

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1950 Giaur at 1952 Targa Florio_ Francesco Donato



(Ken H)

[Ray Bell]

Enterprising lads, Ken...

It's wonderful to plumb the depths of these various endeavours.

[khyndart in CA]

In the 1954 Mille Miglia the DeAngelis brothers competed in their Teraschi Giaur 750 Sport in the Sports 750cc Class.
Although the Panhard Dyna took the top placings in this class. http://www.mcpheatautomotive.co.uk/dyna-x86-sprint/4577598170

The Giaur # 2337 battled to 12th place in their class and finished in 186th overall.
Here are some period photos from the 1954 Mille Miglia.
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(Ken H

[Oldfart]

Those Italians certainly managed to turn out some pretty little cars, and I'm told they did it in a very short time! Blending the shape to be so good on a very small car can't be easy! Maybe lots of ex aircraft skills?

[Milan Fistonic]

I have no idea what it is but it was carrying one of the drivers in the parade lap at the 2019 Italian Grand Prix.

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[Ray Bell]

Looks like it might be Renault 750-based...

But Fiat 600 is also a possibility.

[Oldfart]

Brake drums look more like early Fiat 1100 to me. At least the front ones.

[Kwaussie]

Might be an early Renault Alpine?

https://f1i.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/XPB_1006729_1200px-545x363.jpg

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by Oldfart
Brake drums look more like early Fiat 1100 to me. At least the front ones.

I'd agree with that, but both ends...

It's the height and placement of the engine cover that tends to indicate that it's built around a power unit that hung out the back and was a vertical inline four.

[khyndart in CA]

Here are a couple of photos that may help nail it down.
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[Oldfart]

Sure looks like REAR engined.

[Ray Bell]

Also rear swing-axled...

[Roger Dowding]

Tried to resize - expand the photo but lost clarity - the chrome lettering on the nose has the right number of letters for
" R - E - N - A - U - L - T ".

That will fit in with rear engined - swing axle - R 4 ! - ? [ 4CV ] the 750 cc .. the 1950's era.

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4CV - a correction

[Oldfart]

Might be an early Renault Alpine?

https://f1i.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/XPB_1006729_1200px-545x363.jpg

Being an Alpine fanatic/rivet counter (not really a rivet counter) I know of no Alpine that looks remotely like that.
While I would like it to be Renault, or Alpine, there are too many clues of other bits to not be one. Brakes for one, Renault don't have anything like it.
Italian GP suggests Italian origin, even though the F1 guest is a Renault based one according to the ha etc.
My gut feel is a lovely little later "Etceterini" special. Roger, R4 was front engined. 4cv/750,Dauphine, R8 or what the Ozzies call a 760 was rear engine.

[Ray Bell]

The Aussies call them 750s...

Probably modern enough to be from a Dauphine, were they about 900cc?

The R4, Roger, was front engine, front wheel drive.

[Oldfart]

The 4CV was marketed in Australia from 1949-1961, initially as the Renault 760 and later as the Renault 750.[3] It was imported in both fully assembled and CKD form, with assembly of the latter undertaken in Sydney.[

[Ray Bell]

Well, I did say 'Aussies call them 750s'...

My recollection of these dates right back to when they actually were selling them, and as a keen young kid taking an interest in every car I saw, with a father who knew what they all were, I would say my introduction to the 750 name was about 1951 and I have never heard anyone, not ever, call one a 760.

It would be interesting to see the relevant page in a Glass' Guide.

[Milan Fistonic]

They were called 750 in 1953

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[Ray Bell]

You remind me, Milan...

I have a small number of Motor Manual editions from that era, I can check them.

[Roger Dowding]

The Aussies call them 750s...

Probably modern enough to be from a Dauphine, were they about 900cc?

The R4, Roger, was front engine, front wheel drive.

Ray and Oldfart yep had forgotten that 4CV, should remember as had a a rental R4 the '80's car - front wheel drive in Noumea in 1984

[Milan Fistonic]

I've found a couple of references to Renault 760s in early AMS magazines.

This from AMS June 1951

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This from AMS March 1953. The results of the ASSC's Clubmen's Trial

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[Ray Bell]

Yes, I finished up going through the 1949 AMS binder today...

I found the road test (September or October, 1949) and it was referred to as a 760 there.

On the way home tonight I phoned Bob Winley, he's older than me and has a clear memory of this sort of thing too. He doesn't remember them ever being called 760s either. And he had a neighbour with a 750 'from the very earliest times', he said.

The other point I'd like to make about the little blue car is that the louvres over the engine do look a lot like the 4CV Renault louvres.

http://www.theroaringseason.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=64569&d=1577681419

Having Fiat brakes would have been pretty normal, I'd reckon, as the Renault ones wouldn't have been nearly as good and there was adaptation going on to get the wire wheels as well.

But surely, somewhere on the internet, someone will know exactly what it is?

[Oldfart]

I have tried communicating with the photographer, no reply yet.
Ray, if you went back to Aussiefrogs (yes I know) you will find a lot of references to 760s.

[Ray Bell]

Oh?

Only since they did away with me, I'd imagine.

[928]

Yes, I finished up going through the 1949 AMS binder today...

I found the road test (September or October, 1949) and it was referred to as a 760 there.

On the way home tonight I phoned Bob Winley, he's older than me and has a clear memory of this sort of thing too. He doesn't remember them ever being called 760s either. And he had a neighbour with a 750 'from the very earliest times', he said.

The other point I'd like to make about the little blue car is that the louvres over the engine do look a lot like the 4CV Renault louvres.

http://www.theroaringseason.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=64569&d=1577681419

Having Fiat brakes would have been pretty normal, I'd reckon, as the Renault ones wouldn't have been nearly as good and there was adaptation going on to get the wire wheels as well.

But surely, somewhere on the internet, someone will know exactly what it is?
looking at this photo it appears if the nav/passenger is waving to the assembled masses and the driver is studying his GPS to see where the next corner is. lol

[Milan Fistonic]

Those Etceterinis would have trouble trying to outrun this police car.

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[khyndart in CA]

I have a project for whoever wants to help us.
From the sticker and logo I found this site that just needs translating (right click ) and finding this little vehicle that Milan has taunted us with !
ACI Storico home site.
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https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&prev=search&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=it&sp=nmt4&u=http://www.clubacistorico.it/index.html%3Fno_cache%3D1&xid=17259,15700023,15700043,15700186,15700190,15700256,15700259,15700262,15700265,15700271,15700283&usg=ALkJrhjSRb3V77SYNlwpoY88kHNO2KhIMQ

[Roger Dowding]

Yes, I finished up going through the 1949 AMS binder today...

I found the road test (September or October, 1949) and it was referred to as a 760 there.

On the way home tonight I phoned Bob Winley, he's older than me and has a clear memory of this sort of thing too. He doesn't remember them ever being called 760s either. And he had a neighbour with a 750 'from the very earliest times', he said.

The other point I'd like to make about the little blue car is that the louvres over the engine do look a lot like the 4CV Renault louvres.

http://www.theroaringseason.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=64569&d=1577681419

Having Fiat brakes would have been pretty normal, I'd reckon, as the Renault ones wouldn't have been nearly as good and there was adaptation going on to get the wire wheels as well.

But surely, somewhere on the internet, someone will know exactly what it is?


Being French-ish - even though at the Italian Grand Prix parade ... The Colour - French Racing Bleu / Blue .. ?? I think 4CV based [ forget my oops about R4 earlier - regardless I like it ..

[Roger Dowding]

Those Etceterinis would have trouble trying to outrun this police car.

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Takes me back to Pukekohe GP late 1960's when this was the Clerk of Course car - forgotten who owned it - details I think on the Pukekohe Thread.. Milan Ken and others were there, no doubt ..

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[Oldfart]

Emails sent to see if we can resolve " Le Petit Bleu"

[Ray Bell]

Be still, my heart...

Looking forward to hearing the response(s).

[928]

and the french number plate in #55

[928]

and the french number plate in #56 &58

[Oldfart]

Number plate maybe won't help, as you get a new one when you change address (arondisement) or owner.
It's a reason why chasing factory French rally cars (in my case Alpines) and histories becomes very blurred, might be a particular car with a new custodian, might be a totally different car. Sorry for going OT.
EDIT, I'm unsure that's a French plate. I have just gone through all the clubs photos on their website for 2019(none of the car in question, but lots of cool cars) and many of the older cars have plates like this one.

[khyndart in CA]

One more photo Roger for you to tell us what this vehicle is.
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(KH)

[Milan Fistonic]

Found it -RENAULT 750 SPORT 1954 on an old racing car in rally Mille Miglia 2018 the famous italian historical race 1927-1957.

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Ray Bell got it right with the first reply.

[Oldfart]

As usual Milan got it first!

[Oldfart]

As usual Milan got it first! I have been trying, and found it as a one off special.
Placed 231 #324 MARANI Carlo I GIROLAMI Gianandrea I RENAULT 750 SPORT 1954 3

[khyndart in CA]

Thanks Milan and Rhys,
That was a good challenge and being a one off special made it even tougher.
Well done.
Now I can move on with my life, such as preparing to go to Taupo, NZ, later next week.
Cheers,
Ken H

[Ray Bell]

So where did the brake drums come from?

There's still digging to be done...

[Roger Dowding]

So where did the brake drums come from?

There's still digging to be done...

Indeed Yes, thanks to Ken, Milan Ray and Rhys and maybe even me .. he he !!

[khyndart in CA]

Ray,
This is how the brakes were described for a 1954 Stanguellini 750 Sport which is probably very similar to the 1954 Renault 750 Sport.

"Al-Fin drum brakes were placed on all four corners and provided adequate stopping power for the 12-inch Borrani wire wheels."
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Read on; https://www.conceptcarz.com/vehicle/z14434/stanguellini-750-sport-internazionale.aspx

https://forums.aaca.org/topic/133754-alfin-brake-drum-repair-replacement/


(Ken H )

[Oldfart]

So where did the brake drums come from?

There's still digging to be done...

Having had Fiat 1100 drums in my possession I would suspect those being on the front, they are lovely large, finned alloy ones. The rears on this car look smaller than the Fiat 1100 (same diameter front and back).
Remember special builders don't like to spend money, or at least didn't back a few years. Borrani wheels weren't expensive (well not too much). Of course, we don't know how original this is, may have been "improved" in recent times.

[Ray Bell]

It probably was, of course, harder to graft Fiat 1100 drums onto the swing axles...

Or maybe an earlier Fiat 1100 drum was used or perhaps drums from another Fiat. I'm well aware that the 1100 drums were Alluminium with steel liners, I have also seen them up close. Malcolm Smith and I once started to build a car using a Fiat 1100 front suspension.

[khyndart in CA]

Another one-off special was the 1954 Giaur Record Car with a Giannini G2 Supercharged DOHC Engine.
Designed and built by Berardo Taraschi for driver Jean Grusset to set record speeds for the 750cc class at the time.
In recent years it has been beautifully restored.
I could not find any information on the brakes, perhaps it didn't have any !
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Undated ad.

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[khyndart in CA]

This site has a wonderful photo gallery and video of the above car and also check the workmanship of the interior etc.

https://www.historicautopro.com/1954-giaur-750-record-

A 1954 photo of this Etceterini Special.
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(Ken H)

[Roger Dowding]

There is an online Email /Magazine called " Veloce "- produced by a Peter Vack which I get weekly
The 31st March issue is full of things Italian, Etcetrini, Bandini ALFA and the foreigner Gordini - the French version of Carlo Abarth, by all accounts or vice versa Carlo of Amedee ..

A montage of Gordini - not sure how that goes in plural remember the Lotus Loti story ;

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If any want the link to the Email - let me know - you can join up - get the basic post for free but can subscribe for in depth articles

A Bandini - just to keep it Italian
The note with the photo
" Thirteen years ago, we wrote a little story on the little ones at an SCCA race at Atterbury, complete with photos from the collection of Bandini racer Clair Reuter. Sandy McArthur was there too, circa 1954. "

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[Oldfart]

OK, I know it's not Italian, sorry Ken, but as it's been niggling at me the posts around #81, have a look at this page.
http://www.spiritracerclub.org/les-barquettes-sport-derivees-de-la-4-cv-renault/

[Roger Dowding]

Thought the Ray Green photos ERC collection in the last day or so were familiar Gordini - which started on this thread after the posting of the Renault Spyder / Roadster.

There was this montage from Peter Vack of Veloce and now ERC's photos of a couple of the same cars

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ERC's pics.

Sports Car
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Racing car -single seater !
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Ken H,hope you are well on the way to recovery after the Op.. and Lockdown.
Cheers
Bringing the thread to the top [ briefly ? ]!!

[Ray Bell]

One or two of those are from Monaco Historique...

I have several Gordini pics from there, but they definitely don't qualify as 'etceterini' as they're bigger cars.

For my Gordini pics at Monaco:

https://dodgeforum.com/forum/members-rides/426498-ride-along-with-me-7.html#post3467911

And for my Gordini pics from the Schlumpf collection:

https://dodgeforum.com/forum/members-rides/426498-ride-along-with-me-8.html#post3480610

and...

https://dodgeforum.com/forum/members-rides/426498-ride-along-with-me-7.html#post3480300

A couple of posts separate those.

The Schlumpf brothers bought about 15 Gordinis left over from the early racing days at some time in the sixties.

[Roger Dowding]

" PBX: The American Etceterini Goes Racing "

" PBX: The American Etceterini


Sean Smith documents the story of Candy Poole, who created what was perhaps the most successful H Modified SCCA race car of the 1950s. Poole's son provides the photos as Part 1 looks at the creation of this fantastic machine. "

The Story and some of the Poole collection photos - as shown on the Peter Vack - Veloce - newsfeed that Ken H knows about.

The Story ;
" By Sean Smith

The PBX was also punching above its class. Some of its victories were against cars with twice the displacement. Candy was an excellent driver, but he was also a great tactician. He didn’t just arrive and drive. When he went to a track, he came with multiple differentials with ratios from 6.0 to 4.875. He would match them with multiple sets of wheels 12”, 13”, 14” right up to 15”, depending on the length and grade of the course. Candy also added a jack to the front springs, allowing him to dial more spring tension and dial it out as needed. The same went for the rear. The differential acted as an anti-roll bar, and depending on how he adjusted the radius arms and upper control arms, he could get more stiffness in the rear. That way, he could totally control the front and rear handling dynamic and make the car completely neutral.

His shop also had a dyno and used it to check horsepower between events. He also was constantly testing new carburetor, manifold and exhaust setups that raised the Crosley’s output from 32 HP of the 1952 racing Hot Shot to a snarling 65 HP a few years later, doubling the output. This was pretty much unheard of in amateur racing of the 50s. Candy was constantly endeavoring to optimize and refine the racer. He brought a level of professionalism to the sport that predated Group 44 and Roger Penske.

Candy was a force to be reckoned with in the Northeast racing community of the 1950s. His mechanical acumen and driving ability made him a constant front-runner. He was a true competitor, but he had no problem maintaining other people’s race cars, and he happily coached and tutored drivers to make them more competitive and safer behind the wheel. He was very open with his knowledge but kept a few secrets to give himself an edge. Candy knew his car so intimately that they became one on the track.

Candy’s son Larry remembers a race at Thompson where Max Hoffman brought a specially imported Porsche Spyder to the track to run in class G, showcasing it to the racing community. He had ace race driver John Fitch behind the wheel to really show what the German factory car could do and how it would decimate all comers. For the entire race, Candy was on Fitch’s tail, and if he could have gotten around, he more than likely would have driven away from him. It took all of John’s racing ability to stay in front of the home-built special. It was such an embarrassment to Hoffman they loaded the car on the transport and left as quickly as possible. Candy felt if they had let him set the Porsche up for the track, he would never have gotten near it.

The only other car Candy raced other than the PBX was a Porsche 550. He was invited by Bob Davis, a fellow driver he met in the Bahamas during Speedweek, to co-drive at the 1955 12 hours of Sebring. They came in 11th overall. After a time, the partners at Pallotti & Poole were not agreeing on the time Candy spent on the race car. Candy was ahead of the curve with the ‘race on Sunday sell on Monday’ metric; his partner disagreed, and they went their separate ways. After that, Candy opened his own garage.

After a few years, he wasn’t doing anything with the car and wanted it to go to a good home. Candy sold the PBX to long-time friend J.D. Iglehart in the late ‘70s without an engine. JD restored it and dropped in a rare 750cc Coventry Climax engine. From there, it was campaigned in the Vintage Sports Car Club of America by J.D.’s stepson Jeb Ebbott. Jeb joined the club at 18 years of age and started racing the car at 23. He bought the car from JD in 1983. Jeb campaigned the car at Lime Rock, Circuit Mont-Tremblant, and Summit Point, all of the reasonably short tracks. Longer courses, he felt, were too much on the car.

Jeb’s memory of the car is that it was a dream to drive. It drifted so nicely and was so controllable (even when sideways) that you could flick it anywhere you wanted at any time. It was so well-balanced and neutral. In its class at Lime Rock, nothing could touch it. It wasn’t all that fast in a straight line, but it was so much quicker than anything else in the turns, so it easily took on bigger, more powerful cars. Jeb found it easier to drive than his stepfather’s OSCAS. It was lighter and more agile. Jeb campaigned the PBX for many years up to the 2000s, and then it went away.

In early 2020, Orrie Simko got a tip from VSCCA member Keith Goring about the whereabouts of the PBX. It was tucked in a corner of GMT Racing in Newtown, CT. It had a thick layer of dust covering it, but it was complete. Jeb was ready to sell it, and Orrie was the man to get it done. The first thing Orrie did when he saw the PBX was to get to the back of the car to see if it still carried its original Connecticut License plate, XPB. It did.

The PBX was sent to Vintage Machine Works in Bethel, CT, to be brought back to life by brothers Mark and Scott Lefferts. They got it running, and later, in 2020, Orrie took it to Lime Rock Park for the VSCCA Fall Finale to show it with other cars he had available. Jeb came to see the car and drove it around. It was breaking up at 4000 rpm, so he asked the brothers to do a bit more work. The car was now running well and ready for a new home. People were nibbling around the car but not making a commitment. Orrie had one very interested client who was way too tall and couldn’t fit in the damn thing. This became an obstacle for several prospective buyers.

Then, like Cinderella and the glass slipper, the right person who was the perfect fit came along. " More to come I presume about the car in the 2020's

A lot of story guys - lets get to the pictures.

The car still unpainted with the Owner / Builder at an early event with the Connecticut Plate XPB

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Race Number #74 and class H appear in most photos.
Mt Equinox Hill Climb
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SCCA Nationals at Beverly Ma in 1955

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Candy Poole being chased by a future owner in his 750 Osca - another small capacity Italian racer.

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At Brynfan Tyddan - presume either getting ready to race or after an event.

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[bry3500]

I'm digging this 1954 Stanguellini. Photos by JoeyM