Photos: The Allan Cameron Collection - Part 1

[Steve Holmes]

19292

I'm very pleased to announce a new historic photo collection for us to enjoy here at The Roaring Season. Allan Cameron has been a Roaring Season member for some time, and you will have no doubt seen some of his photos in amongst various threads. Now we're putting them all together on the one thread. Actually, make that a couple of threads.

Allan is a New Zealand motor racing enthusiast, who attended and photographed at several events in the North Island during the 1960s and '70s. He isn't a professional photographer, just an enthusiast, and his collection captures some great cars and moments in the sport. All the photos are colour, even the earliest ones, which date back to 1963.

I'm just going to post these all in random order, based on event. Lots of great stuff in here, I think you'll enjoy it. My thanks goes to Allan for taking the time to have his old images burnt to cd, and for sharing them with us.

[Steve Holmes]

OK, where to start? How about Mt Maunganui, 1963? Or is it 1964? This is Ernie Sprague in his famous MkIII Zephyr, giving it heaps. Note the close proximity of the spectators to the track!

19293

[Steve Holmes]

I thought it might be fun to zoom in with some of these shots where the cars are a longer distance away. Here is the above photo, with emphasis on Ernie. Who is chasing in the Cortina?

19294

[Steve Holmes]

More saloon car racing action from Mt Maunganui. Allan has labelled the folder for this event as 1963, but could it possibly be 1964? Anyway, who is racing the black Ford Consul? Both Spinner Black and Robin Tanner raced similar looking cars to this. The Jag giving chase, could this possibly be Ian Dow?

19296

19295

[Steve Holmes]

Mini's, A35, and Anglia slide through.

19303

19302

[GD66]

Calling Milan....
I think the grey mini is the Matamata driver Tim Parker.

[Spgeti]

Its a Mk 1 Zephyr Steve....

[Steve Holmes]

Ahh, thanks Bruce, I thought it looked a bit like a Consul, but it makes sense you'd race a Zephyr, not a Consul.

[Steve Holmes]

ID help is always appreciated here guys. Looks like a Chevy coupe just shooting out of frame. Possibly George Bunce?

19306

[John McKechnie]

Ahh, thanks Bruce, I thought it looked a bit like a Consul, but it makes sense you'd race a Zephyr, not a Consul.
Actually Steve, makes no difference- Robin Tanner fitted a Jag motor to his racing MK 1 Consul

[Steve Holmes]

This appears to be Frank Matich in the Lotus.

19337

[GD66]

Indeed, a 19B. He also turned out in Total colours at the Mount (and I'm sure, won) in his Brabham BT7A which was later Red Dawson's car.

[Grant Sprague]

I thought it might be fun to zoom in with some of these shots where the cars are a longer distance away. Here is the above photo, with emphasis on Ernie. Who is chasing in the Cortina?

19294

Look at the attitude of Kerry,s car ..... they tried just as hard then as to day [PERHAPS HARDER] as there were 2 chocolate fish , & a mortgage

[tonttu]

ID help is always appreciated here guys. Looks like a Chevy coupe just shooting out of frame. Possibly George Bunce?

19306
#67 Lotus Cortina is JM Noyes from Drury according to the entry list posted on another thread

[Oldfart]

Actually Steve, makes no difference- Robin Tanner fitted a Jag motor to his racing MK 1 Consul

Didn't Ivan Cranch have one too?

[Spgeti]

Actually Steve, makes no difference- Robin Tanner fitted a Jag motor to his racing MK 1 Consul

I agree John...they were just shells to stuff a larger engine into them. I can remember a Mk 1 Zephyr with a 272 ford V8 linked to a Mk 7 Jag gearbox etc etc....that was the beauty of motorsport back then

[John McKechnie]

Bruce- love it mate : they were just shells to stuff a larger engine into them

[David McKinney]

#67 Lotus Cortina is JM Noyes from Drury according to the entry list posted on another thread
No doubt a close relative of the Drury racing-driver J M Hayes...

[Grant Sprague]

Look at the attitude of Kerry,s car ..... they tried just as hard then as to day [PERHAPS HARDER] as there were 2 chocolate fish , & a mortgageMind you chocolate fish went a very long way in those says , & they gave you them to appear & race :cool:

[Michael Clark]

These are good!

[Grant Sprague]

My good friend Kerry is giving Ernie a good hurry up , Im sure its not Paul , was there that weekend probably about 9 yrs old

[Steve Holmes]

Looks like Matich again, possibly Jim Palmer chasing?

19469

19468

[Steve Holmes]

Some help needed for this one.

19471

19470

[Steve Holmes]

..... and then, moments later.

19473

19472

[Howard Wood]

Abenethy (spl?) in the yellow Cooper?

[Grant Ellwood]

Bruce Abernathy? The guy who rolled out to the grid at a Levin race in a Cooper with "wobbly" wheels and Bruce wearing a Noddy hat.
Also a very brave speedway motorbike racer.

[Russ Cunningham]

Bruce Abernathy? The guy who rolled out to the grid at a Levin race in a Cooper with "wobbly" wheels and Bruce wearing a Noddy hat.
Also a very brave speedway motorbike racer.

Gidday Shag,

Imagine turning up on the grid wearing a Noddy hat today? No one would know what you were smoking.

I remember that meeting, even though I'm much younger than your good self.:rolleyes:

[David McKinney]

Bruce Abernethy in the single-cam T41 Cooper-Climax chased by the Lotus 18 of fellow Wellington driver Peter Slocombe

[stubuchanan]

..... and then, moments later.

19472

Was this a time when his crew reattached the the engine cover with a rope, and didn't notice the rope went over the hot exhaust pipe.........? Abbo was quite a circus turn sometimes.... Rothmans Cooper NZGP 1965(?) GP Start!!!

Stu

[Steve Holmes]

More saloon car action. The A40 looks like that which Kerry Grant raced in 1963. But I believe this might be from 1964, so can anyone ID the driver? And those of the chasing cars?

19576

19575

[Steve Holmes]

More Mini's.....

19578

19577

[David McKinney]

More saloon car action. The A40 looks like that which Kerry Grant raced in 1963. But I believe this might be from 1964, so can anyone ID the driver? And those of the chasing cars?
19575
28/12/63 in fact. Murray Reynolds in the ex-Grant A40 chased by Ken Kaye's older model

[David McKinney]

More Mini's.....

19578

19577

West Marshall's 850 in front. I don't recognise the other car

[Rod Grimwood]

#30 White A30 chasing may be John Windleburn ?

[Steve Holmes]

28/12/63 in fact. Murray Reynolds in the ex-Grant A40 chased by Ken Kaye's older model

Well done David, many thanks. That explains why Allan has them listed as being 1963 photos, but I thought they were from the 1964 season.

[Steve Holmes]

More battling Mini's.

19633

19632

[Steve Holmes]

Here is the Zephyr again, being hounded by what is probably Paul Fahey's Lotus Cortina, as he chases after Ernie Sprague.

19635

19634

[Steve Holmes]

Could the black MkI Zephyr be Ivan Segedin?

[Steve Holmes]

^ ^ Actually, to answer my own question, Segedin was racing an Anglia that season.

[GD66]

Yeah, the grey #60 mini with a bonnet strap and headlights out is Tim Parker.

[Oldfart]

Big cut aways on the rear guards! The Mk1 Consul and Zephyr do have subtle differences, wheelbase is different for one. By the time the Mark 2 came they shared the body shell, but according to owners groups the MK1 is different. (Rivet counter/anorak)
When did Ivan Cranch, previously mentioned start with his one. It was certainly at early Pukekohe meetings.

[bob homewood]

Saloon car photos , no 69 (A40 ) defiantly Murray Reynolds ,63 the (A35 ) is Ken Kaye from Rotorua ,I was there with him,likewise was with Wes Marshall 59 ( as David has said ),I think the Mini with the yellow bonnet is Roy Harrington .60 (Mini ) is Tim Parker ,the Mk1 Zehpyr with the cut out guards possibly Spinner Black,the 67 Lotus Cortina is Joe Hayes .David might know the Chev Coupe could be a chap by the name of Ward from Wellington,Jaguar is John Ward ? the Anglia behind the minis going on the colour Tony Lawrence ,long time ago but I think that is how I remember it

[David McKinney]

#30 White A30 chasing may be John Windleburn ?
No, about six years too late for that combination

[David McKinney]

David might know the Chev Coupe could be a chap by the name of Ward from Wellington,Jaguar is John Ward? The Anglia behind the minis going on the colour Tony Lawrence ,long time ago but I think that is how I remember it Keith Ward did run a Chev coupé, but my memory is it was an older model, and rougher than the car in the picture, and I don't remember him ever taking it far from Wellington. Agree about John Ward, but not sure about Tony Lawrence. I only remember his Anglia in Molyslip colours the following season - no mental image of it in 1963/64:)

[Steve Holmes]

Saloon car photos , no 69 (A40 ) defiantly Murray Reynolds ,63 the (A35 ) is Ken Kaye from Rotorua ,I was there with him,likewise was with Wes Marshall 59 ( as David has said ),I think the Mini with the yellow bonnet is Roy Harrington .60 (Mini ) is Tim Parker ,the Mk1 Zehpyr with the cut out guards possibly Spinner Black,the 67 Lotus Cortina is Joe Hayes .David might know the Chev Coupe could be a chap by the name of Ward from Wellington,Jaguar is John Ward ? the Anglia behind the minis going on the colour Tony Lawrence ,long time ago but I think that is how I remember it

Bob, you beauty! Many thanks.

[Steve Holmes]

I've had to adjust the following images, with limited success, because they were quite dark.

19656

[Steve Holmes]

From the sports car race.

19657

[Steve Holmes]

19658

[bob homewood]

Well the No 27 Mini is Roy Harrington ,possibly confirms what I thought in the other photo, No 47 the MG Midget is Josh Mahon, Single Seaters ,Lotus no 22 is none other than one Roly Levis ,the Red no 25 possibly Rex Flowers also in a Lotus with Andy Buchanan on the far side ,the car on the second row far side Dene Hollier Cooper ,I think the car nearly obscured by the bushes at the very rear is the M & K Smith Lola

[David McKinney]

Agree about the front row. I think the other car on Row 2 might be Jim Boyd in the Valour (image discoloured by age?), then on the third row Slocombe (Lotus) behind the bushes, Bryan Thomas (Gemini) and Ken Sager (Lotus). The only other starter was Morrie Smith (Lola) but it doesn't look like that car right at the back. Perhpas, on looking again, you're right about Smith being hidden by the bushes, which would mean it's Slocombe at the back, but the car on the back of the grid doesn't look right for him, either...

[stubuchanan]

Agree about the front row. I think the other car on Row 2 might be Jim Boyd in the Valour (image discoloured by age?), then on the third row Slocombe (Lotus) behind the bushes, Bryan Thomas (Gemini) and Ken Sager (Lotus). The only other starter was Morrie Smith (Lola) but it doesn't look like that car right at the back. Perhpas, on looking again, you're right about Smith being hidden by the bushes, which would mean it's Slocombe at the back, but the car on the back of the grid doesn't look right for him, either...

Could the car at the very back row be Neil Whittaker's Cooper? He was a finisher in the main race. It looks a lighter coloured car and rear body looks too high for more modern cars. Car behind the bush must be the front-engined Lola of Smith. Colour of Valour looks about right - I will post a December 63 Puke photo for you.

Stu

[stubuchanan]

Could the car at the very back row be Neil Whittaker's Cooper? He was a finisher in the main race. It looks a lighter coloured car and rear body looks too high for more modern cars. Car behind the bush must be the front-engined Lola of Smith. Colour of Valour looks about right - I will post a December 63 Puke photo for you.

Stu

Pukekohe February 1964 actually, shot from old Stewards' stand.

http://s6.postimg.org/fpgf7ggz5/Boyd_Valour_Feb_64.jpg (http://postimage.org/)

Valour reappeared on a trailer with damaged bodywork a bit later. Not unusual for Boyd/Valour that season.

Stu Buchanan

[David McKinney]

Could the car at the very back row be Neil Whittaker's Cooper? He was a finisher in the main race. It looks a lighter coloured car and rear body looks too high for more modern cars. Car behind the bush must be the front-engined Lola of Smith. Colour of Valour looks about right - I will post a December 63 Puke photo for you.
Stu
The race in question was the so-called "Formula NZ" race, a year before anyone else sought to cash in on the growing number of 1500/1600/1650 cars racing at the time. I think the limit was 1600, so Whittaker's 2-litre Cooper would have been too big. My lap-chart has only nine cars passing me on the first lap... There were 12 entries, but Young (Cooper), Thomas (Barden) and Stone (Cooper 500) were supposedly all scratchings. Or the mystery car might be the Barden, which didn't make it as far as my position

I think the Valour was unpainted at its December 1963 Pukekohe debut, then BRG

[bob homewood]

David ,I had confirmation today from another source ,Young ,Thomas and Stone don't figure in their records of actually starting the race either ,apparently the Race was called Formula NZ and Formula 3 Cars ,I am no further with the coupe identity either




The race in question was the so-called "Formula NZ" race, a year before anyone else sought to cash in on the growing number of 1500/1600/1650 cars racing at the time. I think the limit was 1600, so Whittaker's 2-litre Cooper would have been too big. My lap-chart has only nine cars passing me on the first lap... There were 12 entries, but Young (Cooper), Thomas (Barden) and Stone (Cooper 500) were supposedly all scratchings. Or the mystery car might be the Barden, which didn't make it as far as my position

I think the Valour was unpainted at its December 1963 Pukekohe debut, then BRG

[Steve Holmes]

This is excellent info guys, many thanks.

[Steve Holmes]

OK, the photo in post #48 is the first in a sequence of four, as the cars take their places on the grid. I hope I haven't created any confusion by not posting these next photos sooner. You can see a marshall in that photo in post #48 signalling a driver to move into position on the second row.

19695

[Steve Holmes]

All in position now, and awaiting the starters signal.

19696

[Steve Holmes]

And the start.....

19697

[David McKinney]

All in position now, and awaiting the starters signal.

19696

Front row: Levis (nearest camera), Flowers, Buchanan
Second row: Boyd, Slocombe
Third row: Thomas, Sager, Hollier
Last row: Smith

That makes more sense...

[bob homewood]

That all makes sense to we as well

[Steve Holmes]

Moving now to Levin. Still the same season, 1964, as shown above. Kicking off here with a fantastic shot of Red Dawson, the former speedway driver, lighting up the rear bags in his Willys coupe, which was repowered with a Chevy V8. Chasing Dawson is Kerry Grant, who would go on to win the NZ Saloon Car Championship that season.

19796

[Steve Holmes]

More Levin tin-tops. Can anyone here ID these drivers?

19797

[bob homewood]

I would believe the No 30 Anglia is Ken Richardson from Rotorua ,the 88 Anglia Morrie Hogan,I think the Cortina is once again Kerry Grant and the Anglia that is just coming into the photo with the "Sabrina "" headlight covers is Jack Nazer

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks for this Bob, you're a legend!

Here is the next one.

19873

[Steve Holmes]

And a sports car race.

19874

[Oldfart]

Post # 64 A40 Brian Ax?

Yes confirmed as Chopper (by him), he is coming back with the others.
BTW he has a collection and wants to know about an original copy of this.

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks Rhys, could very well be? Doesn't he still own this car?

[Oldfart]

Thanks Rhys, could very well be? Doesn't he still own this car?
I am waiting for a call back from him. He bought it back some years back and still campaigns it.

Refer to the post above, now edited.

[seaqnmac27]

He had one still back in 1991, his son, Clark, drove it school at PNBHS and our senior master, Errol Brookie made reference to its pedigree, therefore I'd say this is the first one as I am sure the one Clark drove was blue.

[bob homewood]

Mini 57 would be Don Dawson ,did he own a men's outfitters or similar in Taupo? 60 is indeed Chopper Ax.,the next Mini 40 is I believe Tony Gilbertson from Hastings



Here is the next one.

[David McKinney]

And a sports car race.

19874
March 1964
Geoff Sands in the red MGA 1600, followed by Russell Grace's 1500 and the 1600 of one G P McRae, with Dauntsey Teagle in the light blue Sprite

[Oldfart]

He had one still back in 1991, his son, Clark, drove it school at PNBHS and our senior master, Errol Brookie made reference to its pedigree, therefore I'd say this is the first one as I am sure the one Clark drove was blue.
That blue one wound up in my hands, completely different car. There was pedigree of A40s in the family, but the blue one was never a race car. As usual teachers got it wrong. (I do a bit of teaching myself!)

[Steve Holmes]

Great stuff guys! Many thanks.

[Steve Holmes]

OK, possibly Andy Buchanan leading? But who is chasing?

19985

[GD66]

Is it Roly Levis, as seen on the previous page at the Mount, with one of his 2s removed ? Red nose, silver helmet...

[bob homewood]

Is it Roly Levis, as seen on the previous page at the Mount, with one of his 2s removed ? Red nose, silver helmet...

It is Roly ,he used no 2 for the March 64 Levin meeting

[David McKinney]

Permanent numbers weren't fixed as early as 1964 - you could ask for a particular number, but if a local hotshoe already used it, organisers tended to allow him to keep it, and make the visitor change. Some circuits (Wigram, perhaps?) routinely ignored all requests

[Steve Holmes]

Hey you guys, this is great! Many thanks.

[Steve Holmes]

So here are both are again, heading through the one right-hander corner in the Levin track.

20068

[Steve Holmes]

20069

[Steve Holmes]

Help required as always guys, but possibly Tony Shelly in the Lotus?

20136

[hilstwist]

I think you are right

[bob homewood]

Yes Tony Shelley it would possibly be from the same March 1964 Levin meeting,a lot of people have forgotten or don't realize in 1962 he competed in three F1 World Championship events and a handful of non Championship ones

[Michael Clark]

Yes Bob he is one of 8 kiwis to start a F1 GP

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks guys.

[Steve Holmes]

Any help with this one? I've zoomed in on the car. Could it be Rex Flowers in the Gemini?

20168

20167

[Grant Ellwood]

I have the tail section of that Gemini stored somewhere.

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks Grant. So it IS Rex Flowers in the Gemini? Is this the car Jim Barclay now owns?

[bob homewood]

That is the Gemini ,but I believe that is in the time when Mr Thomas owned it from Fielding .it would have been in 1340 cc engine size at that time

[GD66]

So would that be Brian Thomas, the engineering wizard and motorcycle racer from Feilding?

[Grant Ellwood]

Didn't Roy Lyme win a NZ hill climb championship in the Gemini?

[Michael Clark]

Jim Barclay today confirmed that that is Bryan Thomas in the Gemini

[David McKinney]

Didn't Roy Lyme win a NZ hill climb championship in the Gemini?
No, he bought the Gemini after twice winning he Hillclimb Championship in a Cooper-Porsche

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks for the info guys.

[Steve Holmes]

The last of the photos from Levin. This looks to be Kerry Grant taking a victory lap in the back of the Alpine. Has he just won an open wheeler or saloon car race?

20192

[David McKinney]

If it's 1964 it will be a saloon race

In any case, he tended to wear overalls when racing single-seaters

[bob homewood]

If its the March meeting he won four races in the Lotus Cortina that day

[Steve Holmes]

Thanks for this you guys.

[hilstwist]

They must have used that Sunbeam Alpine far taking winners around Levin for at least a couple of years after that. its the same car I bet that there is a couple of shots of with Jim Clark on the back in earlier thread of my photos.Followed by some EH Winfield s/wagons.

[Steve Holmes]

Yeah thats a good point Steve!

[Steve Holmes]

Following on from the Mt Maunganui and Levin events in 1963, Allan didn't take any racing photos again until 1970, including the Bay Park Xmas event. This is a neat shot, capturing two of the Cambridge team cars, in Paul Fahey's new Mustang, and Rodger Anderson's BMW, speeding past in the background.

20209

[Steve Holmes]

This event featured a strong line-up of big banger sedans, including the big block Australian Camaro's of Terry Allan and Bryan Thomson, plus American Joe Chamberlain. This is Chamberlain, in his '69 Camaro, which was an SCCA A Sedan/Trans-Am car, with 5 litre motor, and so was down on power compared to the larger capacity NZ and Aussie cars. Ian Rorison had bought the Camaro off Joe, and it was driven by Dennis Marwood for the next couple of seasons, then later by John Riley.

20210

[Robert Bailey]

Question guys?

In NZ were the Trans Am cars aloud to run as per the way they ran in the States and were all the said makes able to race ie Javlins ect.
Where as in Australia only certain makes models got a look in.

Did many change to Webers over 4 barrel carbs and what about rear brakes and wheel width?

[Steve Holmes]

Yes Robert, pretty much any production car was accepted in NZ, unlike Australia where CAMS approval was required. I know Jim McKeown tried to get a Javelin accepted to race in Aus in 1972, but was turned down.

Re the fuel systems, yes this was free, as it was in Aus, quad-Webers were common, both down-draught and side-draught, but I don't think anyone in NZ ran fuel injection, at least not in the late 60s or early 70s, not on a V8. Wheel widths kept changing, I think they were out to about 14" by 1973. When Jim Richards first bought the Sidchrome Mustang to Aus in 1975 it was still fitted with 14" wide wheels, and he was given a short grace period to fit the maximum 10" wheels under Sports Sedan rules.

[Steve Holmes]

Oh, and yes, the Trans-Am cars from the US racing in NZ could race in their Trans-Am spec, but any of these that stayed in NZ were invariably upgraded, as the NZ rules allowed more freedoms than the Trans-Am rules, which were limited to 8" wide wheels and from 1970, a single 4-barrel.

[Robert Bailey]

Ta,must have been plenty of money in NZ in the late 60s and early 70s,going on the amount of V8 Trans/Am cars that were racing.

[GD66]

Well, NZ was flogging wool and beef flat out all over the globe, wages weren't great but stuff was cheap. Crowds were big, and engineering nous was rampant, so on top of having kiwis winning the first and last GPs of the 1960s, motor sport was just hammering. At the end of the year, the F1 cognoscenti would come down under for a cruisy summer holiday based around the Tasman series, and the Bay Park promoters, thinking outside the MANZ circle, introduced Formula A/5000 and Big Banger saloons, both of which captured the public's interest. Yep, it was all go...

[Steve Holmes]

Such a shame another spectator went and stuck their head in the way just as Allan was taking this photo. Could have been such a neat shot of these two exciting Aussie big block Camaro's of Terry Allan and Bryan Thomson. Despite all their power and fury, both cars struggled to match the pace of the Fahey Mustang around the tight Bay Park layout, particularly Thomson, who was laying down licorice strips exiting every corner. But the punters loved it, Bay Park was a sell-out on this day, and the organisers actually had to close the gates at just after 2.00pm to prevent more people getting in. It was a full-house.

But it was a great field of cars, including the Fahey Mustang and Chamberlain Camaro, both pictured above, the two Aussie big block Camaro's of Allan and Thomson, plus Kiwi drivers Rod Coppins (Camaro), John Riley (Mustang), Clyde Collins (Falcon), etc. Jim Palmer in the ex-Foley Porsche was also there, as was Jim Richards in the Willment Racing Escort TC, among others.

20214

[seaqnmac27]

Such a shame another spectator went and stuck their head in the way just as Allan was taking this photo. Could have been such a neat shot of these two exciting Aussie big block Camaro's of Terry Allan and Bryan Thomson. Despite all their power and fury, both cars struggled to match the pace of the Fahey Mustang around the tight Bay Park layout, particularly Thomson, who was laying down licorice strips exiting every corner. But the punters loved it, Bay Park was a sell-out on this day, and the organisers actually had to close the gates at just after 2.00pm to prevent more people getting in. It was a full-house.

But it was a great field of cars, including the Fahey Mustang and Chamberlain Camaro, both pictured above, the two Aussie big block Camaro's of Allan and Thomson, plus Kiwi drivers Rod Coppins (Camaro), John Riley (Mustang), Clyde Collins (Falcon), etc. Jim Palmer in the ex-Foley Porsche was also there, as was Jim Richards in the Willment Racing Escort TC, among others.

20214


With Reg Cook in the background.

[Oldfart]

Ta,must have been plenty of money in NZ in the late 60s and early 70s,going on the amount of V8 Trans/Am cars that were racing.

And some of the car dealers who were, to be polite, less scrupulous than the vast majority of the population, had money to stop the tax man getting his hands on.;)

[kiwi285]

I personally think that the Fahey Boss Mustang in the Cambridge Racing Team colours was one of the smartest cars around and still rings my bell.

[John McKechnie]

Mike- absolutely .There are those who would say that I am biased, I make no excuses for being in complete agreement and that the original so startlingly clean in white. Much better than any later colours.

[stubuchanan]

And some of the car dealers who were, to be polite, less scrupulous than the vast majority of the population, had money to stop the tax man getting his hands on.;)

Hang on a minute OF, you can't have it both ways. Probably half of the drivers mentioned in this thread have been car dealers at some stage of their careers. I can recall only a small number of them ever running afoul of the law. However I would concede that a thread on the topic of dodgy dealers might not be a good move.

Stu

[Robert Bailey]

Bit like Australia for many years the top drivers were new and used car dealers.
Hunt,Jones,Stillwell,Mildren,Brabham,Jane,Beechey,Geoghegans ect.

[Oldfart]

Hang on a minute OF, you can't have it both ways. Probably half of the drivers mentioned in this thread have been car dealers at some stage of their careers. I can recall only a small number of them ever running afoul of the law. However I would concede that a thread on the topic of dodgy dealers might not be a good move.

Stu

I did say some.

[stubuchanan]

Humblest apologies, Oldfart, you did indeed say some car dealers only.

A short time after I posted the reply, I remembered that my brother, who had been finance manager or "Loan Arranger" for several years for a franchise dealer, found himself looking for a new job after that firm retrenched or downsized.

He found a similar job with another car dealer who, if not an actual motor sport participant, had considerable connections with the sport. Brother's first and only day there was spent largely in finding out just how many illegal financial practices were going on. He chose not to go back the next day!

Stu

[Allan]

This is a wonderfully interesting site, in that a collection of old images can stir the memories of car dealers as some of the used to be. So lets not mention too many names in conjunction with shifty deals that occurred long ago.
I hope you are enjoying my photos some of which have never been seen by anyone but myself.
Regards to you all.
Allan

[Oldfart]

This is a wonderfully interesting site, in that a collection of old images can stir the memories of car dealers as some of the used to be. So lets not mention too many names in conjunction with shifty deals that occurred long ago.
I hope you are enjoying my photos some of which have never been seen by anyone but myself.
Regards to you all.
Allan

We certainly are Allan. They are bringing back a lot of memories, and inspiring a fair few to delve into the shoe boxes full of photos which we thought we had lost. Thanks.

[Steve Holmes]

Here is Jim Palmer in the controversial ex-Brian Foley Porsche, leading Jim Richards in the Willment Escort.

20294

[Frosty5]

Here is Jim Palmer in the controversial ex-Brian Foley Porsche, leading Jim Richards in the Willment Escort.

20294

Steve, memory has faded a bit over the years but what was the controversy over the Porsche?

[John McKechnie]

Frosty- These cars were run in Australia, Jim Palmer brought this here.
The cabin size was protested about , being too small for a saloon car,no room for normal passengers in the back. so it was a sports car.
Car stopped racing and sold.
So The controversy compounded when the rules about saloon car cabin sizes changed again.and suddenly these were sedans.
Jim Short tells about how he raced his as a Sports Sedan.
Try taking 4 adults that have been in a Mini, Escort, Mustang and then put them in a 911.
Also around that time, Scott Wiseman entered his E-Type one week as a saloon, next time as a sports car.
Controversial is a suitable word here, go figure.

Info update15-8-
remember at that time there was Saloon Car and Touring Car controversy also-
Faheys Escort did not fit Saloon car, because of motor , but fitted Touring car- taken from Autonews.

[Steve Holmes]

Steve, memory has faded a bit over the years but what was the controversy over the Porsche?

Dave, as John said, it was the cabin space which seems to have been the issue. The same was true in the SCCA Trans-Am. The Porsche's were kicked out after the 1969 season. But they kept racing in Australia, as sedans, and in fact, both the Pete Geoghegan and Jim McKeown 911s were invited to race in New Zealand at different times by event organisers. But these weren't NZ Saloon Car Championship events.

Another reason for the controversy was that the Porsche actually fit into the 4.2 litre class, so was in the same class as the twin-cam Escorts etc, and was much faster. It was really an outright contender. I'm pretty sure Palmer won an NZSCC race outright in this car against the V8s.

[Steve Holmes]

Great Formula C action here, with a sideways Pierre Phillips leading David Oxton (left) and Peter Hughes.

20338

[Steve Holmes]

20344

[John McKechnie]

Steve H-Yeah- the MM article was titled something like-Porsche scares Jockeys off the big boys.

[Steve Holmes]

Another shot of Hughes and Oxton. The Hughes Lotus certainly had some attitude under power.

20449

[Steve Holmes]

OK guys, some of your expert help is required here. This is still the Bay Park Xmas event, from 1970 (December 28, 1970). This race had several scratchings, so it was a depleted field that took the start. The front row consist of Graham McRae and Graeme Lawrence, while Cary Taylor is on the inside of row two behind McRae. Who are the other drivers in the field? Is that Mike Hole next to Taylor?

20783

20782

[GD66]

#19 is John Nicholson in the ex-Oxton BT16, #7 is Peter Moloney's Cooper. Don't recognise #39 by the driver's helmet, but it is the ex-Peter Hughes Lotus, wearing those distinctive Tranzal wheels.

[Steve Holmes]

Wow, took just seconds for a reply to come! Many thanks.

[woody]

This is the 28th Dec. 1970 Bay Park race field.

[GD66]

Bill Smith ?

[beowulf]

Humblest apologies, Oldfart, you did indeed say some car dealers only.

A short time after I posted the reply, I remembered that my brother, who had been finance manager or "Loan Arranger" for several years for a franchise dealer, found himself looking for a new job after that firm retrenched or downsized.

He found a similar job with another car dealer who, if not an actual motor sport participant, had considerable connections with the sport. Brother's first and only day there was spent largely in finding out just how many illegal financial practices were going on. He chose not to go back the next day!

Stu
One of the dodgy ones now "owns" Formula One.

[Steve Holmes]

This is the 28th Dec. 1970 Bay Park race field.

Thanks Woody, this is great!

[stubuchanan]

This is the 28th Dec. 1970 Bay Park race field.

http://s6.postimg.org/xj791sltd/Bay_Park_Dec_1970.png (http://postimage.org/)

Image wouldn't upload for me either, Steve, so I had to do it the long way.

There seems some doubt about the last man/car on the grid. Rest of grid appears to be McRae/Lawrence, Cary Taylor/Mike Hole, then Peter Maloney/ ??. Bill Smith was entered, but so was Baron Robertson, and the ever-unreliable Graham Vercoe mentions him finishing 4th but no reference to Bill Smith. Ken Smith, Radisich, and de Lore practised but didn't run, according to Vercoe, or was he just guessing?

I was 12000 miles away at the time so don't have any magazines or anything to look up, but just to confuse historians even more, as well as Peter Maloney racing that season there was also Peter Mahoney running a Brabham around that time.

Stu

[GD66]

And Jos Mahon as well! I'm sure the #19 car is Nicholson. I can say the Bay Park programmes were only a guide in those days...

[David McKinney]

It's Peter Moloney, not Maloney

And the No.19 car is the wrong colour (and the wrong time) for John Nicholson, but the right colour (and the right time) for Bill Smith

[GD66]

Well that's me shot then.


Never heard of him.

[Steve Holmes]

http://s6.postimg.org/xj791sltd/Bay_Park_Dec_1970.png (http://postimage.org/)

Image wouldn't upload for me either, Steve, so I had to do it the long way.

There seems some doubt about the last man/car on the grid. Rest of grid appears to be McRae/Lawrence, Cary Taylor/Mike Hole, then Peter Maloney/ ??. Bill Smith was entered, but so was Baron Robertson, and the ever-unreliable Graham Vercoe mentions him finishing 4th but no reference to Bill Smith. Ken Smith, Radisich, and de Lore practised but didn't run, according to Vercoe, or was he just guessing?

I was 12000 miles away at the time so don't have any magazines or anything to look up, but just to confuse historians even more, as well as Peter Maloney racing that season there was also Peter Mahoney running a Brabham around that time.

Stu

Stu, I've taken a closer look at why it is some images don't load for some people, and it would seem its the images themselves that are causing the problem. Or, to be more precise, the image types. There are 'jpg' images, and then there are 'jpeg' images. For some reason some computers don't recognise jpeg images, be they on the internet, sent via email, or whatever. Not sure why this is, I can only assume its in the set-up of each individual computer, but I know when I use Photoshop to resize images people send me, Photoshop doesn't recognise jpeg images. I actually have to rename them as jpg images to get it to recognise them before I can do anything with them.

[Steve Holmes]

Here is McRae, who drove away to win as he pleased.

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[Steve Holmes]

http://s6.postimg.org/xj791sltd/Bay_Park_Dec_1970.png (http://postimage.org/)

Image wouldn't upload for me either, Steve, so I had to do it the long way.

There seems some doubt about the last man/car on the grid. Rest of grid appears to be McRae/Lawrence, Cary Taylor/Mike Hole, then Peter Maloney/ ??. Bill Smith was entered, but so was Baron Robertson, and the ever-unreliable Graham Vercoe mentions him finishing 4th but no reference to Bill Smith. Ken Smith, Radisich, and de Lore practised but didn't run, according to Vercoe, or was he just guessing?

I was 12000 miles away at the time so don't have any magazines or anything to look up, but just to confuse historians even more, as well as Peter Maloney racing that season there was also Peter Mahoney running a Brabham around that time.

Stu

OK, magazine report says Ken Smith, Frank Radisich, Peter de Lore, Bryan Faloon, Dexter Dunlop, and Robbie Francevic were all scratchings. Some broke in practice, others didn't actually front. Race report mentions McRae, Lawrence, Taylor, Robertson, Hole, Maloney, and Bill Smith.

[David McKinney]

But not Moloney?:)

[Steve Holmes]

That was just the report David, not the results. It only mentioned those drivers. Thats not to say it was any more correct than the race results given in Graham Vercoe's book, which are as follows:

1. Graham McRae
2. Graeme Lawrence
3. Cary Taylor
4. Baron Robertson
5. Mike Hole
6. Peter Maloney

[David McKinney]

Peter Moloney finished sixth...

I'm not trying to nit-pick unnecessarily, just to make clear it wasn't Peter Mahoney

[stubuchanan]

My apologies for being a little careless several posts ago. If I had looked a bit more closely, I would have seen that Moloney's name was always spelled correctly in any programmes I have, and perhaps only Vercoe got it wrong. I don't have any newspaper clippings for this period, and I'm not sure Moloney's name would have appeared very often, if at all.

In my personal case I find that many people can mis-spell and mispronounce both of my names, and like Eoin Young, I have spelled out my name for people and then watched them write it down wrongly! And it was happening long before the Internet or texting!

Stu (Stuart) Buchanan

[GD66]

Like the spelling of Wenoopy...:cool:

[garry simkin]

Well that's me shot then.


Never heard of him.

Bill Smith was from Hastings, a ''motor engineer'' he liked referred to himself as. If my memory is correct he took the Brabham to Barpark but found the pace a little too hot, and offered the drive to Ken Smith, who may have had a problem with his own car.This car later became a Formula Ford, owned by Eric Anderson and a partner.Maybe somebody in NZ could ask Ken Smith for his take on it.
Earlier Bill had raced a Cooper Norton at various Levin meetings with the formula Vees, in the company of Graham Richards also Cooper Norton mounted.Bill later installed a Vincent engine in the Cooper and this car has been in Australia for some time and owned by Derry Greeneklee. Like-wise Graham Richards Cooper Norton is here as well and forms part of the Penrite collection. Its possible both of these cars will be competing at Wakefield Park at the end of september.
Garry Simkin

[GD66]

Nice one, thanks Garry. I went to pretty much every meeting at Bay Park in those days and was quite perplexed that Bill had slipped off my radar. Although nobody else has been on to update us. So is it in fact the ex-Oxton car ?
I do recall seeing Kenny in the car, in those days the blue windscreen was a feature.

[stubuchanan]

Like the spelling of Wenoopy...:cool:

Ah.. Wenoopy, my alter ego on another motor racing forum.
Derived from an Oz attempt at pronouncing Whenuapai, with spelling by me. I doubt that if I was confronted with Oodnadatta, Murwillumbah, or Nuriootpa, I would have produced something as melodious as Wenoopy.

http://s6.postimg.org/fx8kijgfl/Wenoopy_Mug_Detail.jpg (http://postimage.org/)

Produced in the livery of a well-known NZ brand of tea.

Stu

[David McKinney]

So is it in fact the ex-Oxton car?
No, the ex-Lawrence BT6, which then went to Laurence Brownlie and the usual string of owners before Bill Smith.
IIRC it was converted back from FF spec and raced with a twincam in Historics by Wayne Rodgers and then Paul Higgins before going to Australia

[David McKinney]

My apologies for being a little careless several posts ago. If I had looked a bit more closely, I would have seen that Moloney's name was always spelled correctly in any programmes I have, and perhaps only Vercoe got it wrong. I don't have any newspaper clippings for this period, and I'm not sure Moloney's name would have appeared very often, if at all.

In my personal case I find that many people can mis-spell and mispronounce both of my names, and like Eoin Young, I have spelled out my name for people and then watched them write it down wrongly! And it was happening long before the Internet or texting!

Stu (Stuart) Buchanan
You'd be amazed at the number of people who think my name's McKinley. Yet when I did a check of London phone-books a few years ago I found - to my surprise - that there were far more McKinneys than McKinleys or McKinlays

I knew Peter Moloney when he was racing a Mini, and once or twice stayed in his parents' motel in Auckland. He was subsequently in the same unit as me when we did our National Service in 1966. He was always Moloney:)

[Kwaussie]

He was subsequently in the same unit as me when we did our National Service in 1966.
Photo required ................pf:D

[rf84]

I am not questioning your knowledge David, but you say the Bill Smith car was a BT6. In the reprint of the Baypark programme (post#130) it is entered as a BT15.

[Frosty5]

Ah.. Wenoopy, my alter ego on another motor racing forum.
Derived from an Oz attempt at pronouncing Whenuapai, with spelling by me. I doubt that if I was confronted with Oodnadatta, Murwillumbah, or Nuriootpa, I would have produced something as melodious as Wenoopy.

http://s6.postimg.org/fx8kijgfl/Wenoopy_Mug_Detail.jpg (http://postimage.org/)

Produced in the livery of a well-known NZ brand of tea.

Stu

Try this one Stu, FENUAPIE. Better be careful, the PC brigade could be onto us!!!!!

Cheers Dave

[stubuchanan]

No, the ex-Lawrence BT6, which then went to Laurence Brownlie and the usual string of owners before Bill Smith.
IIRC it was converted back from FF spec and raced with a twincam in Historics by Wayne Rodgers and then Paul Higgins before going to Australia

Surprisingly, Graham Vercoe agrees with you in his "Golden Era" book : ( re March 1970 Pukekohe metting) "Bill Smith had acquired Roy Lyme's Brabham after its rebuild from the crash it suffered at Pukekohe.."

Doesn't that gladden your heart, David?

Stu

[David McKinney]

I am not questioning your knowledge David, but you say the Bill Smith car was a BT6. In the reprint of the Baypark programme (post#130) it is entered as a BT15.
Everyone got Brabham BT numbers wrong back in the day:)

In fact I once bought a Brabham (in Hawke's Bay) that wasn't a Brabham at all... :rolleyes:

[rf84]

They're a dodgy lot in the 'Bay David!

[Steve Holmes]

Here is Graeme Lawrence in the Ferrari.

21029

[Steve Holmes]

Couple more shots of the lively Hughes and Oxton battle to round out this event.

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21218

[Steve Holmes]

The small batch of photos that follow and round out this chapter of the Allan Cameron Collection are from the Bay Park Easter event in 1971.

First up is Peter Hughes in the Lotus, now looking less like a Gold Leaf tribute car with its bright pink nose.

21268

[Steve Holmes]

Hughes again, chasing, I believe, Jim Murdoch in the Titan. Is this the car David Oxton drove the previous season?

21269

[Steve Holmes]

And another shot of Hughes.

21270

[Michael Clark]

I've been forwarding these all on to Pete - I think it fair to say he is pleasantly surprised...

[Michael Clark]

And and and

Steve, #85 is the same livery as Oxo's car but Dave drove an Elfin 600.

[Allan]

Michael would you please pass on my best wishes to Pete. We both worked at Town and Country Cars in Auckland back in the early 70s which explains the large number of photos of him. Also please tell him that I ran into John Weston recently, with whom Pete shared a FIAT 1500 in a Benson and Hedges race.
Allan Cameron

[Michael Clark]

Will do AC!

[Steve Holmes]

Michael would you please pass on my best wishes to Pete. We both worked at Town and Country Cars in Auckland back in the early 70s which explains the large number of photos of him. Also please tell him that I ran into John Weston recently, with whom Pete shared a FIAT 1500 in a Benson and Hedges race.
Allan Cameron

Thanks Allan, I figured it must have been something like that.

[Steve Holmes]

And and and

Steve, #85 is the same livery as Oxo's car but Dave drove an Elfin 600.

Thanks Michael.

[Steve Holmes]

Michael, Peter will love this one!

21299

[Steve Holmes]

Here is Peter Hughes battling with Dauntsey Teagle.

21300

[Steve Holmes]

Someone spins at the hairpin in the Formula C race.

21301

[Steve Holmes]

OK, last two pics from this chapter, and its big banger sports car action. The first shot has Grahame Harvey in the Elfin 400, complete with its tall aerofoil, leading Garry Pederson in the Gemco Oldsmobile, and Digby Taylor in the McBegg. The second shot shows the same three cars, in different order.

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21382

My thanks to Allan for allowing this wonderful collection to be shared on here. I hope you've all enjoyed this first chapter. I'll be beginning Part 2 in the next couple of weeks.